Mobil 1 5W-20

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Does anyone know if Mobil 1 is yet available in the large 5 quart jugs in 5W-20 weight? My local Wally World only has 5W-20 in quart bottles. They have 5W-30 and 10W-30 in the large jugs, but not the lighter weight.
I don't know if this is a Mobil issue or a Wally World just not yet stocking it issue.
Matt
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Matt,
I don't know, but I will check at other retailers. I have a brand new Super Wal-Mart only about 1 mile from my house - I will check it too.
Don
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Don Allen wrote:

My local Wal-Mart is a super store also and I checked a local Auto Zone as well. The AutoZone didn't have ANY 5 quart jugs of Mobil 1, just dino oil. Could be that Mobil isn't yet shipping the large jugs of 5W-20 until they are selling more of it, but the shelf was nearly empty of the quart bottles of 5W-20 so I'd say sales are picking up.
Matt
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Matt,
You're right . . . I checked my local Super Wal-Mart, and they don't stock the 5 quart jug of 5W-20 Mobil 1. I did find a "short case" (6 quarts) of 5W-20 at our local Blain's Farm & Fleet, but this store chain is only in Illinois, Iowa, and Wisconsin.
I guess everyone will just to have to buy single quarts for the time being. BTW . . . I checked with the Service Advisor and Service Manager at the local Hyundai dealer, and they exclusively use 5W-30 weight oil. This, of course, is an OK alternative and listed as such in the manual - at least it is in my 2006 Elantra.
One item of note: The wider the range of a motor oil, the larger amount of V.I. (Viscosity Indexers) required. I was told by a petroleum engineer here at the University of Illinois a number of years ago that the greater amounts of V.I.'s used in motor oil, the greater the propensity for varnish build-up and eventual sludging. I don't know if this is a proven fact or not, but he's personally a great believer in 10W-30 weight oil. It's generally good down to 0 degrees F, and even my new Elantra Owner's Manual recommends this weight if ambient temp is above 0 degrees F. In this case, 10W-30 Mobil 1 may be just fine for most applications, especially due to its good pourability, etc. at low temps, except where severe winters are the norm. Just a thought . . .
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Don Allen wrote:

I currently use 5W-30 in the winter (we often get well below zero here in northern PA) and 10W-30 in the summer in my other vehicles and likely will do the same with the Sonata, at least until 5W-20 is available in the larger jugs.
Thanks for checking.
Matt
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Matt Whiting wrote:

If the recommended oil is 5W-20, 5W-30 would work OK, but 10W oils would not be recommended. The key is the weight of the base stock. 5W-20 and 5W-30 are made from the same 5W base stock. 10W oils are thicker and won't flow as well. If the reason that 5W-20 is recommended is due to tight clearances and small oil ports in the engine, a thicker oil could cause oil starvation, leading to excessive wear and bearing damage, especially if you live in a cold climate.
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Brian Nystrom wrote:

I'd have to re-check the manual, but I believe that all three weights are OK to use given the right temperature range. 5W-20 is the preferred oil, but I believe both 5W-30 and 10W-30 are acceptable.
Yes, all else being equal, 10W oils won't flow as well as 5W oils, but all else isn't always equal. Viscosity numbers are given for a given temperature (I forget the specifics now) and don't cover the behavior of the oil at other temperatures. For example, a 10W dino oil will flow the same as a 10W synthetic at only ONE temperature. At lower temperatures, the more stable viscosity of a synthetic means that the same weight synthetic will flow much more freely than the dino oil. My 10W-30 equipped minivan and truck crank much better at -10 than does my Sonata with 5W dino oil.
Matt
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Matt Whiting wrote:

You'll probably find that 10W oils are recommended for warmer climates and summer use. I've never found any good reason to switch to thicker oils in summer. As long as the upper end of the viscosity range is adequate (the 30 in 5W-30) the heavier base stock isn't going to make any difference and I'd rather have the better flow characteristics.
Out of curiosity, have you ever heard of anyone having an engine failure due to oil that was insufficiently protective at higher temps (viscosity breakdown)? It seems to be the thing most people worry about, but I've never heard of such a failure. Using oils that are too heavy and cause starvation seems to be a much bigger issue, at least in modern engines.

True. That's one of the reasons I use synthetic oils in my Elantra, both in the engine and transmission. The transmission oil in particular makes a big difference when temps are 0F or below.
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I only run Castrol SYNTEC* in my cars. Oil change every three months

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Dumbass wrote:

Man, that is wasting a lot of good oil and filters.
Matt
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Matt Whiting wrote:

Perhaps, but it depends on how much he drives. If he's doing 2500 miles/month, he's right on schedule.
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Brian Nystrom wrote:

True, but few people drive exactly 7500 miles each quarter.
Matt
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Dumbass wrote:

Brand of oil is largely meaningless, since any oil that meets API specs is going to last longer than Hyundai's recommended 7500 mile change interval. That's doubly true of synthetics. Tests I've seen on synthetic oils indicate that there's little practical difference between them. Even Walmart's low-priced, house-brand "SuperTech" synthetic seems to be as good as the big name oils. I've used it with no problems, though lately, Pep Boys has been running specials on Pennzoil synthetic at ~$2/quart, so I've bought some of that.
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Brian Nystrom wrote:

Can you point me to these tests. I've never seen the off-brand SuperTech tested anywhere.
Matt
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Matt Whiting wrote:

I don't it bookmarked, but IIRC, I just did a search on "Supertech synthetic oil test" or something similar and waded through the results. I found the results from a testing lab that analysed it and gave some conclusions based on what they found. Essentially, they said the base stock is the same as many other brands (not surprising since the blender makes oils for several other companies, including big name brands) and the additive package is comparable to what other oils use.
When you get right down to it, nowadays, oil is oil. The differences that companies tout in order to attract consumers are so small as to be irrelevent. Modern oils are incredibly good. Just look for the API seal and if an oil has it, it's more than good enough to put in your engine. I would avoid oils that are not API certified, unless you're willing to spend the money for Amsoil. I'm not.
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Brian Nystrom wrote:

I agree that most oils are good enough most of the time, but I disagree that oil is oil. About the only independent and fairly comprehensive test of oils that I've seen was done by MCN (Motorcycle Consumer News) magazine. They have tested oils twice in the last decade or so and the difference between the top and bottom oils is very dramatic, often 2X or more in tests such as the ability to maintain viscosity, etc. Cheap oils really are much worse than top rated oils. It may not make a difference if you drive your car only 100,000 in easy conditions and then trade it in, but if you drive 200,000 plus as I intend to (except my last two vehicles got totaled at 143K and 182K), in a variety of conditions from -20 to over 100, in the mountains, etc., then I'd rather have the good stuff.
Matt
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Matt Whiting wrote:

Please define "2X". It's extremely important to put the differences into context. What are the tested parameters? What are the differences in terms of actual durability in the engine?
There is also a substantial difference between the operating parameters of motorcycle engines and automobile engines. In particular, motorcycle engines routinely operate at rpms that are double that of car engines. That creates very different stresses on oils. An oil that is "superior" to another when used in a motorcycle engine may be no better in a car engine, in practical terms.

In what regard? Specifics really matter here. Blanket statements like that aren't helpful.

I see your point, but I'm not convinced that it makes any difference. The length of time you intend to drive your car doesn't matter. What does matter is how long you leave the oil in the engine. If you want to push the envelope on oil change intervals (10K miles+), it makes sense to use the most durable oil you can find. If you change your oil at suggested intervals, any oil will last that long. That's been shown in numerous studies.
It's well know and accepted that that ~90% of engine wear occurs on startup. Oils that flow better, such as synthetics, will help reduce wear, as they get to all parts of the engine faster. However, if you really want to extend the life of your engine, install a pre-oiler. That ensures that the engine is fully lubricated BEFORE you start it. That should make much more difference in wear and long-term durability than one's choice of oil.
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Brian Nystrom wrote:

I don't have the magazine handy and I don't recall all of the parameters tested, but it was things like TBN, levels of certain friction reducers, oxidation reducers, etc. They provided bar graphs for all of the relevant tests and the height of the best oils was twice that of the cheap oils and sometimes even greater disparities.
There is no easy way to measure differences in engine durability in a controlled way and it would cost millions to even attempt that. So, you have to use surrogate measures.

They tested both car and motorcycle oils. There conclusion was that most motorcycle oils weren't different enough from car oils to justify the price premium. But it did appear that good oils were much better than cheap oils. And synthetics were much better than most dino oils.

Call up the folks at MCN and buy a back issue of the magazine that contained the oil test. I'm sure they will know which issue and can sell you a copy. I can't remember the specifics from 5-6 years ago. And you wouldn't believe me anyway so do some research for yourself.
http://www.mcnews.com/mcn /

Sure it matters how many miles you drive your car. If the engine wears twice as fast using a cheap oil as a premium oil, then it will run half as many miles. If the premium oil wear rate will let the engine last 250,000 miles, then the same engine with the cheap oil can be expected to last only 125,000 miles. This isn't rocket science.
You say numerous studies, can you point me to one?

Again, any proof for your statement? I've heard this as well, especially in the aviation industry, but I've also seen many counter examples that suggest otherwise. For example, the airplanes that are started most often and flown the least hours at a time are single-engine trainers, yet their engines often last much longer than large singles that are flown 2-3 hours at a time.
I've seen many suggestions that frequency of operation of the enigne is more important than the number of starts and shutdowns. However, I've seen NO data that supports either hypothesis, just anecdotal information and observations.
Matt
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Hey Matt - can I jump in for a bit? Thanks.
While taking no exception to your point, I'd ask if that mysterious point of diminishing returns plays in here. Conventional dino oil will do a fine job of protecting a car and providing a 250,000 mile life expectancy with ease. Folks like myself adhere to a 3,000 or 4,000 change interval and the concept of dino oil giving this kind of performance is well established. Synthetics are supposed to provide the same level of protection with half the oil changes.
So my question is - is there really a useable difference between the premium oils and a standard oil? Heck, what is a premium oil? Does that term imply synthetic, or does it include dino oils with certain additives? I find it easy not to argue with the notion that a super grade of oil will offer longer protection, but my question really centers around whether that is ever even noticeable in the life of a car. For the sake of conversation, I assume the life expectancy of a car to be 250,000 miles. I have enough experience getting this kind of life out of my motors with conventional dino oil that it's no longer anecdotal to me.
Did I just stumble over a point that's already been covered in this thread, and that I missed?
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-Mike-
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Mike Marlow wrote:

It well may. I use synthetic mainly for cold weather starts as I find that my vehicles start much better and my batteries last much longer using synthetics. I've gotten 8-9 years out of several batteries in cars with synthetic oil and used to get 3-5 using dino oil.

From a wear standpoint, I believe there is a difference, but I agree that it may not matter in the typical lifespan of a car. However, I don't know that any data exists on this point one way or the other. I have seen engines taken apart with well over 100K on them, and the engines with synthetic oil are vastly cleaner than those using dino oil. This may or may not matter, but if a chunk of sludge breaks loose and clogs an oil passage, then I suspect that the synthetic oil will have been much better. :-)
Matt
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