Nice try, but Sinan points out exactly what I was saying before. A
difference of "2X" is meaningless without context. Depending on the
context it can be a big difference, or completely insignificant. Do you
know what the context of the data in the study you referred to is? For
that matter, do you even know what parameters were measured? Was it
frictional resistance? Viscocity vs. temperature? Levels of chemicals as
in the above analysis? Something else. Your claim of "twice as good" is
meaningless unless we also know "compared to what?"
I saw the data. I own the "How to Lie with Statistics" book that was
required reading in my statistics class at Penn State a couple of
decades ago. The MCN data was extremely well done.
It is funny how some of you like to throw stones at data that you are
too cheap to spend a few bucks to get a copy of and actually see for
yourself. You must be a statistician...
On the other hand, my comment was not specifically about the data, but
only about the fact that without knowing the scale of the vertical axis,
the heights of the bars in bar graph do not convey meaningful
Frankly, I do not know anything about oil, and I don't much care. As
such, I am unwilling to invest any time or money in researching the
That should make it obvious that I am an economist who occasionally
A. Sinan Unur < email@example.com>
(remove .invalid and reverse each component for email address)
I'm coming in late here, but last I heard, SuperTech is re-labeled
Penzoil/Quaker State, in turn made by Shell. I suppose that would quickly
change if Wal-Mart would get a better contract from Texaco, BP, Exxon-Mobil,
Actually, SuperTech comes from Warren Oil, a large blending company that
produces oils for many labels. I didn't realize how the industry worked
until I checked into SuperTech oils. Many of the oils on the market are
not blended by the companies that sell them. Companies like Warren buy
base stocks from refiners (like Shell), blend in an additive package and
resell them to companies that put their label on them. SuperTech is
effectively "generic" oil, in that it comes from the same source and is
likely identical to some name brands, but it's sold cheaper since it's
not advertized and doesn't pass through as many hands in the supply
chain. It may well be indentical to Pennzoil and/or Quaker State.
The oil MAY be identical, but it may not be. Even worse is that it may
vary widely from lot to lot as often the oil is whatever is available at
the lowest price at a given time. All crude oils aren't created equal.
Also, another cost that is often less for generic oils in addition to
advertising costs is QA test costs. They very likely don't test to
nearly the level that a brand does who has a name to protect. Remember
the hit that Quaker State took back in the 70s (if memory serves) when a
bad lot of oil got out and ruined a number of people's engines. It took
decades for their sales to recover, and I don't think they ever did
fully recover. I used Quaker State at that time and haven't used it since.
Well, you are correct that it may be not be consistent. But if they promise
Wal-Mart 1 quality level of product then try to switch up on them, they'll
be in breech of contract. Wal-Mart is probably in the top 3-4 outlets for
oil. They have an audit system to ensure they get consistent quality, and
their suppliers only double cross them once!
No, I don't think anyone would want to antagonize the golden goose. :)
It comes from ONE source and it's blended to a standard specification.
The lab test I saw indicated that it was comparable to other synthetic
oils on the market. Your comments are just idle speculation with no
basis in fact. Fear mongering doesn't help anyone.
Again, I ask to see the mysterious data you keep referring to, but can't
seem to produce a reference to. I provided a clear reference to the
source of the data that I saw that is in direct conflict with your
claims that all oils are created equal.
Apparently, posts with attached binary files are blocked by the news
server, as I've tried twice to post the .jpg of the oil analysis. I'll
email it to you if you want it and it won't even cost you anything.
Super Tech oil is packaged by Warren Oil. They do not add or delete anything
from the oil that they repackage. I've been using Super Tech synthetic in my
vehicle for several years with no problems, and I called them to find out
what kind it was. They said it's made by specialty oil which is Pennzoil, or
Quaker State - they are the same, just different bottles.
Just type super tech in the product name box http://msds.walmartstores.com/
If you search on "synthetic", you'll see that both Specialty and Warren
are listed for SuperTech synthetic oils. I'm not sure if one is the
manufacturer and the other is the distributor or what, but the dates on
the MSDS's overlap.
The source is known (Warren Oil). It's the MSDSs that are confusing. The
data on the product is in my other post. Now it's your turn to put up or
shut up. So far, you've given us nothing but a link to an article that
we would have to purchase. I'm not going to do that.
I understand you not wanting to see the data as that would put to rest
all of your complaints about it. The report isn't available for free,
nothing I can do about that. Most legitimate data isn't free.
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