OT: Fuel prices, not quite what you'd expect..

The bit I don't understand is what they are trying to say putting "in re= al terms" and "not adjusting for inflation" together.

I didn't hear that presumably on Today? Maybe I'll try listen again. Got= to admit some earning around 40% more than UK national average going on =

strike for yet more money does not sit easy.

I have the feeling that the companies are taking the piss on conditions =

though by working the drivers to the maximum driving hours/day and > 48 =

hour weeks. Now if that is the case that is what the drivers should be striking for, improved conditions. There is no reason for fuel delivery = to require long hours or long weeks, it just needs a bit of decent planning= and possibly a few more tankers and drivers.

Shh. Otherwise before long you'll need a certificate to be a shelf-stacker too.

Well, I knew a woman in Reading who wasn't what I'd describe as particularly unique or talented who passed her HVG license without much hassle, despite this being back in the 90s and her having to put up with the instructor regularly telling her it wasn't a job for a woman..

If on the other hand there was a very low success rate amongst people trying to be drivers, then perhaps they might have something in it, but I don't believe there's a particularly high fail rate, as in hundreds applying, tens passing.

Ah but that *is* what they are striking for, according to the union rep, they're striking to end long hours and make the public safer by, er, them getting paid more!

"This dispute will go on until such times as our members have pay justices, so that our members don't have to keep working long and unsocial hours putting themselves at risk on the motorways of Britain, and at the same time putting the general public at risk."

So you see, by them being paid more, we'll be safer, because they won't have to work long and unsociable hours and be a danger to other road users any more..

Seems now railway workers are in on the act, rail maintenance staff are on strike so expect the trains to have delays put on the delays;

-------------------- Up to 12,000 Network Rail maintenance staff have gone on strike in a row over jobs and conditions.

The Rail Maritime and Transport union said "100%" of its members walked out for 30 hours from 1200 BST "after months of fruitless talks".

Network Rail said the union had made unreasonable demands, such as a

34-hour working week for all maintenance staff and "massive" pay increases.

--------------------

Politician speak for "I'm trying to pull the wool over your eyes". :-/

Yup. He spent the whole interview avoiding admitting that they're striking (a) because they can get away with it & (b) they think Shell make too much profit, so they want a cut of it. It sounded like a replay of union interviews I remember from the 60s & early 70s. By a strange coincidence, I was driving along the M56 near Stanlow as it was on.

That's the way *I* understood it, anyway. My feeling is that Shell (Reportedly) made a fixed price contract with Hoyer, not with the drivers, some of whom *used* to be employed by Shell until the job was contracted out. The drivers also contracted of their own free will with Hoyer. The dispute's got absolutely nothing to do with Shell. (IMHO)

If they're paid by the hour, I don't see the problem with that. They probably also get paid more for working late/ early/ weekends. Overtime & antisocial hours work is usually "optional". If they're paid by the month, then that's always been what's in the contracts I've been offered & refused. If they don't like it, they can leave.

As far as I can tell, there are a *lot* of unfilled vacancies in the goods transport industry. Of course, not many of them pay anywhere near what they're already earning.

Just another 2 penn'orth.

40 to 80 hours driving tuition over a couple of weeks for most candidates. About £650 for the course. The hazchem you can do in 5 days for a hundred quid plus accomodation, apparently:-

I trust this lot, as I've used them myself, as have people I know, for different courses.

Add a couple of days training on company specific procedures, & off you go.

You'd not get a job immediately without experience, though.

If you feel capable of driving around a 20 ton bomb on wheels for 8 hours a day with suicidal or just plain clueless lemmings attempting immolation as every junction and the possibilty of prosecution just by climbing into the driver seat, get on with it son. You will need to get an ADR licence( renewal every 4 years) an LGV licence ( renewal every 5 years) . On the other hand bomb disposal is less honorous and if you get it wrong the results are similar except if you do make a non-catastrophic error it is electronically saved and you can be prosecuted for it in the next 12 months as a result of a roadside check.

Derek

it isn't?

I think 40 grand a year is adequate renumeration for it though. I doubt bomb disposal men get that much.

Steve

No, because I have a career already. There's no way in the world that I'm not capable of it though, the "bomb on wheels" part is largely imaginary, you don't get them blowing up left right and centre as you would do if the danger was strong given the number of tanker trips done in this country. As for the lemmings and risking prosecution, I get that in my normal car anyway.

Not worth over 40 grand.

With enough pickle, they're about the same.

Nah, too much pickle and the chalk bubbles.

Steve

So what they are saying is that currently we have fuel tankers on our roads under the control of people who are not fit to drive?

So what's new?

To be honest, while they are pulling down 32K for what is essentially a semi-skilled job, I can't summon up a great deal of sympathy.

41K now.. Looks like the lesson here is that if you want a massive wage rise even though you already earn too much, then hold the country to ransom.

-------------------- Tanker drivers delivering fuel for Shell have been offered a 14% pay increase over two years after their four-day strike hit UK fuel supplies.

The increase will be worth 9% in the first year and 5% in the second, taking average annual earnings to 41,750.

--------------------

Right, next week I'm organising a mass blockading of the internet and until people pay security consultants 14% more than they already do, the blockade will continue! We do a dangerous job you know! I can do it because I've got the paperwork, no-one else could!

On or around Sat, 14 Jun 2008 21:50:17 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice" enlightened us thusly:

Shell garage I know got fuel in from another supplier, since Shell['s agent] couldn't deliver, as the tanker had broken down, and it was going to take a week to get a water pump.

Now, I don't see why they couldn't hire a tractor unit to haul the fecking thing. If the fault was in the tank trailer itself, it'd be different.

Meanwhile, I question slightly semi-skilled in these days for a petrol tanker driver. It may not be "skilled", but it carries quite a lot of responsibility. Having said that, I'd happily do it for 35, 36, or 37K per annum (all those figures have been reported)...

On or around Sat, 14 Jun 2008 19:07:16 +0100, Ian Rawlings enlightened us thusly:

well, I could go and get trained, get an HGV and an ADR and so on and then I'd have the bits of paper... if i could afford it. But I don't get 40K per annum.

There's a lot more responsible jobs with more danger that pay far less, you've got to wonder how come they get that much loot for it. If "responsibility" was what you got paid for, you'd get more loot than them!

It still doesn't make it hard or dangerous though, and the instances of tanker drivers being killed is almost zero, I'll bet far more farm labourers, binmen and zoo workers die and they're paid a pittance.