'04 LS430 Being Recalled

I have to agree with David on this, I work for a Lexus dealership and we are not inundated with customers bringing in there ES300, 330's for lag issues, yes we do here from 1 or 2 a month but considering we sell on average 40 of them every month that's a very small percentage. It is a driver/trans issue, not everyone has the problem, it depends on how you drive the car, the more aggressive the worse the problem. The Old ladies driving the car never complain :)

Myles

David Z wrote:

I drove an '02 ES for almost a year and never quite understood what the problem was. Mine seemed fine.

Myles,

Since you work for a Lexus dealership, and see customer issues, perhaps you can answer my question.

On both my current '03 LS430 and my previous '99 LS400 there's a 1/2 to 1 second transmission downshift lag when the car is traveling between 15-40 MPH and I use 1/2 to 3/4 throttle, as in passing.

My dealership has always denied any knowledge of this issue. Have any of your customers had this problem?

Thanks. HBH

Helmar,

It is a "non issue" and I use that term very lightly as it is an issue with you. It has to do with the drive by wire throttle control. The more aggressively you drive the worse the problem is. Being a Manager I get a Demo to drive, I currently drive a GS430, have had GS300's, RX300's (not a

Myles

Helmar Herman wrote:

Myles,

Thank you for your candid reply.

I much prefer an answer I don't particularly like, to "We never heard of that issue".

To my mind, it's somewhat of a safety issue, as several times I've had to abruptly cancel a maneuver because the car wasn't responding as expected. As such, it's difficult to be patient for a fix from Lexus.

By the way, I've posted several times here expressing my satifaction with most of the features of my LS430, especially the NAV system, the laser cruise control, and, in general, the car itself. In fact the only issue I've ever had with either of my Lexus's (Lexi?) was the transmission downshift lag.

Did you really think that Lexus will "fix" the '02, '03, and/or '04? Or do you think they'll just work out the glitches in the next generation? '06? '07?

You're making it appear that this is a problem with all drive-by-wire systems. We have a 2003 ES300 and a 1999 Volvo S80. Both are drive-by-wire, yet only the lexus has the problem.

I was refering to Lexus' Drive by Wire system as I can't speak for other manufaturers, I thought that was assumed. You know what you get when you assume :)

Myles

Being an electronics issue I would assume (back to that again) they would fix the issue for customers who complain about it.

Myles

Forgot to spell check (Manufacturers) ;)

"Bullshit. I knew about it before I bought it. And I bought it anyway."

I guess that makes you a wonderfully intelligent and educated person then. Congratulations, Mr. Wizard.

I drove a Buick Regal that responded better than my ES300. My issue is in wondering why Lexus thought they needed to reinvent this control system, then leave it in a state where it is not predictable. I'd sure appreciate it if you could answer that from Lexus' perspective.

I would not assume anything like that. The Lexus position is that it is working as designed, and that there is no problem.

The drive by wire throttle is a bit artificial feeling, but I don't see how it can be responsible for the tranny lag. I guess it would depend on whether the engine is racing or stalling during the lag event. Has anyone looked at the tachometer during a lag event to see if the RPMs are up or down?

Thank you for exactly defining the core of the problem. People who have not experienced the problem somehow do not seem to understand that there is a different perspective other than their own experience. Does every ES driver have hilly terrain, or lots of stop and go traffic, or do lots of interstate driving every day of the week? No. There is a wide range of driver experiences out there, and the problem with the Lexus drive by wire does not handle the wide variety of conditions adequately. If an auto manufacturer is going to invent an entirely new process within their product, then they should be sure it does everything at least as well as the preceding technology it is replacing, with perhaps some other benefits of the newer technology as a bonus. That can not be said for the Lexus drive by wire. Anybody disagree?

Tranny lag is a generalized expression for the 2 second lag, which is factor of the ECU trying to decide what to do with the tranny and throttle at the current speed. It isn't necessarily a tranny lag, but a processing lag.

And for those folks, no problem exists.

In an ideal world, yes. But in reality, car manufacturers continually reinvent their products and, IMHO, frequently for the worse.

Perhaps. Nonetheless, despite the tranny lag, I chose the ES330 because there's no other car I'd rather buy. I suspect the same is true for you or else you wouldn't be so peeved about it.

Myles: Ya like numbers? Ok. ;-) It is said that out of 3.2 million V6 Lexus/Camry between 1998(?) and 2002(?) only 3,000 or so managed to sludge their engines AND bring them to dealerships for repair (warranty or otherwise). Look at all the grief that has caused Toyota! Now you say barly 2 out of 40 Lexus owners file this "throttle lag" complaint at your dealership. Seems like a MUCH higher complaint rate (%) to me and one that cannot be blamed on owner neglect. How about them apples? ;-)