Why cant Toyota or Honda make a car that drives just like a BMW?

From the dealers, no. Honda part prices are also insanely overpriced. But, there are so many Hondas on the road, the aftermarket has jumped in to fill the void. For example, where the factory wants $600 for a single cv joint, I can get aftermarket cv joints for $140 a pair.

The whole parts industry went berzerk back in the 80's. Used to be you could get factory parts for a decent price. Then, when Iacocca decided to pay back Chrysler's govt loan by quadrupling parts prices, all the other companies followed suit and factory parts prices all went through the roof, never to return. That's why your best bet today is to buy the vehicle that will go the longest before requiring parts replacement. Bingo!! Honda!

nb

nb

Reply to
notbob
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I'm top posting here because if you want to read the rest you can scroll down.

Well faisa lAjmal Sheikh - why no capital for your first name? -

Your argument is slightly flawed as has been proven. But I must agree on some points although you will probably not have thought about it this way.

The LEXUS is a comfortable car, travels along the road quite nicely and carries people in a "safe" way. It will travel at 70mph all day and probably never miss a beat. It looks - well - nice/terrible depending on your view but it works as it was designed to.

Being a match for the BMW, a Mercedes, Cadillac?, Volvo?, SAAB, RR? is something else. Whether or not you love or hate "imports" the LEXUS is not in competition whatever you might think. There is no competition because a BMW or a Mercedes is just that and a LEXUS is just another TOYOTA.

BMW models are all stamped BMW as are Mercedes. (Well some BMW models are now being labeled Rolls Royce but that's a different story as is the VW - Bentley) Mercedes are being re badged Chrysler - well some of the floorpans and running gear is and viz-a-viz but the LEXUS is just another TOYOTA with bells and whistles.

You must remember that, in general, there are speed limits in the US and the UK and most other parts of the world (I know there are exceptions but not many) and all the cars travel quite nicely at 70mph and some at 80mph although most modern cars will surpass the 100mph mark and quite a few this side of the Atlantic UK + Europe will pass the 120mph mark with ease. Above this speed there are a few cars that actually feel safe let alone be SAFE. The Ford Mondeo SST is safe to about 140mph my BMW 740i is too at 155mph. The Aston Martin (Ford) will hit 180 with ease as will many other cars. The Jaguar, McLaren, Lamborghini, Ferrari companies have cars that will clock over 200mph with ease and safely but with a drive trained and experienced at that speed but definitely not in downtown LA, London, Paris etc. as most owners would have you believe.

All the fast cars I have seen in the US are driven slowly - because the owner want's you to get a good look at him/her (posing) and their wealth, good looks, style or whatever. Even the Corvette driver goes slow (70 or under and at the posted limits) so you can have a good look at their taste/style etc.

Experts and lovers of fine machinery will try to drive around in just that. Fine machinery! Of course machinery wears out and breaks down - some sooner than others - but don't mistake style for excellent engineering.

The TOYOTA cars are well built and do what it says on the box so do BMW, HONDA and the others just that some do it better.

Hugh

Intelligence is not knowing the answer but knowing where and how to find it!

Hugh Gundersen snipped-for-privacy@h-gee.co.uk snipped-for-privacy@bognor-bill.co.uk

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Regis, W.Sussex, England, UK

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Reply to
hsg

Which is my point! The Novas that I saw had many more problems and died earlier (my 1987 Corolla went 240k miles before selling it, still driveable and not a rust-bucket). Now, the reasons for differences could be many -- they actually could have had something done differently on the line (I DID notice some cosmetic differences, because several neighbors had Novas); the drivers could be a different type of driver; and so on. At the time, there were numerous cartoons about having an "American" car that actually was "Japanese" (one example was the Nova) and the cartoon showed the salesman making his pitch just as the "American" decal sticker popped off.

Reply to
Randy Given

LOL. Yes, for THEIR crap. So, why did the Corollas in our neighborhoods (and many others that I talked to) last twice as long, have fewer problems, rusted less, etc.

I am well-versed in blind and double-blind testing, so no need to preach to the choir. Still, when I see so many examples of two "identical" things acting so differently?

Reply to
Randy Given

in article iC%8b.440656$YN5.295527@sccrnsc01, notbob at snipped-for-privacy@nothome.com wrote on 9/14/03 10:15 AM:

But now you've changed the subject to fixing your own vehicle with aftermarket parts. BMW's are also far from scarce, and the BMW aftermarket is also huge, and deals abound there as well. Besides this, BMW made a strategic decision in the 90's to reduce parts prices at the dealers. The end result being that their parts prices are pretty much now on par with those of other imports.

Again you have no evidence that this is true. I'd be very surprised if Toyota isn't ahead of Honda on reliability. Second, taking parts longevity as your sole criterion for which car to buy indicates to me that you view a car pretty much the way you view a refrigerator-as an appliance. Others have a different point of view and different priorities around the car they drive. Besides, most all cars are pretty reliable these days. My 330i is far more reliable in its first yr than my 89 Accord was in its' first year. All cars have improved in reliability, with the Japanese doing a bit better on average than the Europeans and a bit better still than the Americans.

Reply to
John Stone

I am in complete agreement. And this applies to more than just cars. The system is wrong. Managers should be picked from the best workers on a project and trained Instead, some MBA with cursory knowlege of the product (and probably someone who could care less what the product is), is hired to manage projects they know little about. The result is cost overruns, late projects, poor choice of employees, bad designs, etc... Of course, some profit from the resulting mess so it's a dysfunctional system that can be lucrative to some.

Reply to
Robert La Ferla

Sorry, but the Nova was nothing at all like a Corolla.

Reply to
DTJ

There is nothing even remotely similar between a Nova and a Corolla.

Reply to
DTJ

Other then the better Delco stereo system, the Nova was virtually identical to the corolla. Back in 1986, it was my first car.

Pars

Reply to
pars

Hate to bust your bubble my friend, but the managers are 'on the floor' at GM and Ford, same as the Japanese managers in the US. I would point out as well that apparently not everyone believes the Japanese make the best vehicles. Both GM and Ford outsell ANY Japanese manufactures in the US or world wide..

mike hunt

snipped-for-privacy@h-gee.co.uk wrote:

Reply to
StoneyRhoades

GM and Ford HAVE to sell more....the cars don't last...

I noticed you just traded your piece of crap Ford in...why???

Scott in Florida

Reply to
Scott in Fla

It was two years old and the tires where worn down a bit. ;)

mike hunt

Scott >

Reply to
StoneyRhoades

LOL

I suspect it will be in ruins by the time it has as many miles as my '92 Corolla!

Good move...get rid of it before it blows up...

Scott in Florida

Reply to
Scott in Fla

I have no idea how long it would have lasted had I kept that one. Pretty long I suppose, the oldest Ford I own is a 1941 and the one with the most mileage is nearing

300K so you will have to ask some other Ford owner who has one older or with more mileage, mine are still going strong. ;)

mike hunt

Scott >

Reply to
StoneyRhoades

I don't know that what you say is accurate. Both cars rolled off the NUMMI assembly line in Fremont, CA

Reply to
Philip®

What an ignorant, rash, and stupid comment.

Yea...there's Mike...and some other guy...I forget his name.

Numbers game...nothing more.

Try using POVs along with affordability numbers...Jap cars *KILL* American cars.

Reply to
NetSock

And it had 500 miles on it.

Reply to
NetSock

I don't.

*If* your even telling the truth, this is either a restore or rebuild.

...and on its third engine...

What a pathetic mark you are...

Reply to
NetSock

Your a complete idiot.

The reason Americans buy foreign cars over domestic, is because we work damn hard for our money, and when we spend it, we want the best value.

The Japanese aren't "smarter than Americans", but rather Americans demand value. And until the American car manufacturers can compete with our Japanese counterpart, *smart* Americans will continue to spend their money wisely.

You should have rephrased your statement to say... "The Japanese are smarter than this American".

Reply to
NetSock

How did your last BMW treat you?

-Russ.

Reply to
Somebody

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