Phaeton W12

So, buy one. Go on, do it, buy one. Now.

Soooooooo tempting. Especially since I can economise on fuel by staying in hotels.

I even saw a Phaeton W12 sailing up the Great West Road with a taxi plate on it, they must be cheap as anything. £15k, they are!

%steve%@malloc.co.uk (Steve Firth) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying:

Nice get-out from the Ken Charge.

Yes I thought that was probably the reason.

Hi, welcome to last months topic of discussion ;-)

But yea they are. The V10 diesel is getting there for the cheapskates as well. SteveH even managed to make a case for the little diesel engined one, the V6 I think? And they can be had cheap as with few miles... I can't think of a single plus point for the 3.2 V6 petrol however. You'll have to work it that hard it'll use as much fuel as the W12 whilst being awesomely slow at the same time. As the boss said they had to be able to cruise at

180 or something and keep the temp the same inside, none but the W12 should have been made cos none of the others, when derestricted, can do 180 heh! Didn't they say on TG that derestricted ones in testing would do 202mph?

Heh, the case for the diesel V6 is that it's just as fast as the V6 petrol, but does double the mpg-ish.

The V10 diesel appears to be a bit of a dog - not *that* much quicker than the V6 diesel, but about as economical as the V6 petrol. Only worth having for the pissing contest of having a V10.

W12s make a lot of sense if you don't do too many miles.

What ultimately put me off any of them is that a lot of stuff can only be fixed or serviced by VW and that most VW dealers aren't allowed to touch a Phaeton - meaning you pay HFM hourly rates for servicing. Even on the V6, which should technically be no more expensive to run than an A6 V6 TDI.

On the subject of VWs, I have here a copy of VAG-COM and a cable - wonder which bizarre 'comfort' settings I can give the Passat before it goes back?

Can't you change the weight of the steering? Stiffen it up to the absolute max, and then take it in a week before and tell them it's just gone that way, then we'll all place bets on how long it'll take them to figure out and how many new steering parts it will get - before something means resetting the system and it being cured :-)

Just had a quick look - £15k for an 03 plater (5.5 years old) with 70k on the clock, or £30k for a 56 plater (2 years old) with 15k on the clock, and it's a VW used approved.

I'll throw it open to the floor - what's the better deal?

I'm kinda simple when it comes to this sort of stuff.

The one that's half the price of the other one ? Forget the fact that the other one is newer, depreciation can't ever be forgotten - and it's 15 grand we're talking about.

the V10 diesel has torque levels that the V6 diesel can only dream of. As torque is a good thing, and there ain't no substitute for cubes, I'd have the V10 if I had to suffer a diesel.

Exactly - *if* you had to suffer a diesel.

Had a little look on parkers earlier on, and here are the economy figures - I've chucked in the 4.2 V8 just 'cos I felt like it:

4.2 V8: 21mpg 5.0 V10 TDI: 24mpg 6.0 W12: 19mpg

Fuck all in it really, especially when there's the potential for LPG in the W12. Would a LWB Phaeton still have reasonable boot space left even with a decent sized gas tank in there, or are the LWB ones all about legroom?

Seems the rest of the world disagreed with you - the V10 TDI has been dropped, as has the V6 petrol.

Range is now V8 TDI, V8 petrol and W12 Petrol.

I never did see the point in a diesel that was less economical than most petrols.

Especially when you consider the vast range of consumption figures you get from a TDI - I reckon you could see anything from 10mpg up to 35mpg from that, depending on how heavily you used your right foot.

At least with the non-turbo petrols, you are more likely to return stable figures close to those advertised.

I don't fully see the point of the V8 petrol when the W12 is barely any less economical and has a fuckload more power. Though if the V8 petrol is cheap enough compared to the W12, then I guess some might buy it.

Yup. Used to be pretty much the opposite way around, but these days with diesels being pushed more and more to produce more impressive power/torque figures, they're also much more at risk of drinking a lot more fuel than people want. Petrols have a much more natural delivery of power and as such, don't need to be stressed in anywhere near such a way.

W12 starts at £74900, V8 at £56670.

553lb/ft of torque was the point.

Heh. And given that the V8 isn't exactly going to be uber-underpowered, £20k extra for the W12 is quite a bit.

The whole lower insurance group thing (which some might mention) is largely irrelevant, 'cos it's either going to be semi-sensible money to insure a Phaeton or it isn't - if it is, then it's not going to be much extra to insure the W12. Ditto for VED, and they'd both probably fall into the top bracket anyway.

But buying second hand, the difference is obviously going to be a lot less, though maybe it isn't, as everyone will want the W12, meaning the V8s won't shift nearly as well, creating a larger price gap than might have been first assumed.

The above was pretty much entirely based on the AstraVanMan school of guesswork economics. It might well turn out to be largely bollocks. All opinions are clearly nobody else's.

rates for servicing.

I noticed that for the first time. I'm outlooking for a DSG Golf, and the one dealer I visited was a "Phaeton Centre". Their other specialisms seem to be "overpricing Golfs by £1500" and calling thenselves "Solihull Volkswagen" despite being in a much less desireable Birmingham suburb.