My '71 SB has a rebuilt 1600DP motor (with approximately 6K miles on it) that it totally stock with the exception of the dizzy. (009) Although it is in great running condition (smooth idle, smooth "power" band, no off-idle stumble), I'm really looking for a little more oooompf.
I'm seriously considering dual Kadrons from lowbugget.com. The price seems reasonable, and the service seems very good.
Will I need a freer flowing exhaust system with this setup? Will I notice the power improvement I'm looking for? Will I be able to enter the freeway without fear of dying?!
Carbs and exhaust won't do much, the biggest "power increase" is actually psychological. Knowing you added "high performance" parts in there, and it got louder.
The carbs and exhaust will do you *some* good, but it won't really make the car much faster. Personally, if these are your potions, I'd recommend that you keep the engine as it is.
However, if you plan to get any noticeable power increase, then these are a must.
To actually make a difference, I would add some stuff on your shopping list:
1) if you aren't prepared to open the enine case, you should at least get a high lift "ratio" rocker kit. This is like using a mild performance cam. Basically adds torque.
2) Crack the case open. Go on, do it. So much good you can do after that for engine longevity and power. Replace all bearings, and piston rings too. Replace cam with a high perf one. Raise compression ratio. Port the heads. Balance and weight-match all rotating parts. Modify case for full flow oil filtration. Teh list goes on and on and on.
Personally I think it's stupid to just bolt on expensive external go-fast goodies on teh engine and demand more performance from it, without first taking care of the basics. It's an old, high mileage, worn engine. You will only accelerate it's wear greatly and it could blow in your face in a very short time. Makes no sense to me. Besides, a simple stock rebuild will already bring you lots of horses, the ones that ran away over the years. If the engine had 50 horses when new, you might have 30 of them left today.
If you accept the risks and low gain with the #1 route, and feel that the #2 option is a bit too involving for your skills/money/time/whatever, then by all means go for it. You may learn something valuable that could come in handy later on. Or you could end up with a smoldering, wailing pile of metal and a truckload of frustration, and you will decide to abandon this stupid hobby.
Actually, my previous '71 SB had an 1835 with dual Kads, S&S freeflow exhaust, mild cam, yadda yadda. I was very pleased with the performance I got from it ... until I blew it up by over-revving 2nd gear!
Because the motor's so new, I have no intent of opening the case just yet. I'm looking for a bare block to start building up (I have built VW motors before for a 67 dune buggy I had), and will just swap that in if I get too underwhelmed by the current setup!
I use the car now mainly for commute, and it's only those rare hiway onramps that are scaring the bejeezus out of me. I'll live with what I have for now.
...................I heard somewhere but I don't remember where that Kadrons instead of a single 34PICT on an otherwise stock 1600DP will get you about ten more horsepower along with better responsiveness and better mileage depending on how fast it's driven. I'd think that a ten horsepower increase on an engine that's only making fifty to sixty horsepower would be significant and worthwhile. Of course, a merged header exhaust and higher ratio rockers would make it that much better and without any disassembly of the longblock. If I ever get one of those new Mexican engines for my '66, that might be what I'll do with it. Then I could take my time rebuilding the original 1300SP that's sitting on a bench in my garage.
See, Tim, that's what I had heard, also. That's why I was considering the change. I've got an e-mail into A.J. at lowbugget.com. I'll see what "the expert" has to say about it!
Believe me, there's enough other stuff to do on Herman without putting useless dual carbs on him!
Regarding horsepower: You guys are now talking about 10% increase, and while you might be able to feel it, I personally wouldn't bother for such little gain. DOUBLE or nothing. Less that that just doesn't seem worth it.
100hp is still relatively easy to get and it will stay very driveable. Of course, that's no longer 1600. (Although I have driven very streetable 1641cc 150hp engines as well, in a very light car.. we build them for race)
I have always found that a well tuned 1600 engine is all that is necessary to move a bug down the road with a reasonable accelerator response. It does not hurt to remember that the 1600 engine is ~20 percent larger than bug engines sold elsewhere in the world. As such, you already have a stock high-performance four banger.
You could build yourself up a 1776 engine and grab a few more horses from that. Or decide that you're not really an ACVW kind of driver, and get yourself one of those rice burners with an exhaust tip the diameter of a trash can.
I haven't been watching too closely Chris but is their "Supercase" usually more than $379.95 or did you see them advertised less somewhere else? I have a "tired" AS-41 case that I got with my '62 rag and it looks like someone let it sit in a puddle for awhile (the bottom edges are all corroded off), then they painted it black, yech :o(. It seems a shame to stick all the new parts I've been accumulating (Engle 110 cam, Mahle 90.5 P&C, Webber dual 40 IDFs, CB 044 Magnums, etc.) on such a rotten case. I had looked at the regular AS-41 case CB offers for 279.95 before, wonder which case my application would benefit most from. That extra $100.00 could go a long way towards my next purchase
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. I heard from anengine builder buddy of mine these are Chinese? but he hadn't heard anythingbad... yet.
G
On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 19:31:49 GMT, "B.C. Bugger" ran around screaming and yelling:
i have a cb "supercase" which i purchased on 9/2/03 for 469.95....that is the "normal" price....Marieanne told me in an email that the "special" price was because they needed to "move" them...
that also is a "special" price, that won't last forever...if you are not stroking your engine, then the "regular" stock case may be your best bet...
to call them "chinese" is kind of misleading....many of the performance cranks on the market are forged or cast in china and then machined in the US....the supplier don't always mention that...
Thanks for the info, very much appreciated. :o) I guess it would pay to order up one of dem cases a.s.a.p.!! As soon as I post this, actually! I reckon the crank can wait a month or so... hopefully.
...............You might be right about this. Conventional 'theory' about a stock 1600DP with a single 34PICT carburetor, is that the solex is the main bottleneck at about 4000 rpms. It just won't efficiently permit enough air flow above that speed to generate any more significant power. This is precisely what the engineers in Wolfsburg probably intended. The Kadrons get rid of that bottleneck and allow better breathing at a higher rpm where the stock exhaust and low-lift cam & rocker arm set-up becomes the limiting factor. The biggest problem with moving the power band up to a higher rpm range is that a stock long block with a non-counterbalanced crankshaft and no dynamic balancing of the pulley-crankshaft- flywheel-pressure plate assembly is gonna beat the case to death eventually. If I ever did buy a new Mexican engine, I'd have to do some soul searching about whether it's a good idea to do anything that would allow it to turn up to higher rpms inorder to make more power. If you're going to crack the case inorder to install a counter-weighted crankshaft and get everything balanced, it might be a better idea to just buy a new case and build what you want from scratch. In conclusion, I'd say that Kadrons can make more power on a stock 1600 but will also shorten its life because that power is mostly available at about
5000 rpms where the rest of the engine becomes a time bomb that will self-destruct if it's flogged too much too often. The addition of an aftermarket performance exhaust system along with high-lift rockers would move that power band even higher where the whole process of self-destruction is even worse. This is all conjecture on my part but I've killed several good engines over the years by pushing them past their limit with a lead foot.
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