Why Jeeps suck.

Approximately 8/13/03 11:28, Kenneth Garman uttered for posterity:

..... yadda yadda yadda and then tried to run Moab.

Hey dude, that aftershave doesn't really make chicks want to jump your bones either....

And yet you bought a Liberty?

If you wanted a vehicle capable of going anywhere, you should have bought a REAL JEEPtm........

I have an '87 Cherokee Laredo, 4.0L stock motor, D44 rear axle, and close to

Had you lurked here for a while prior to buying your Chrysler, you'd have known which of the models are realy Jeeps, and which are Chrysler's attempts at grabbing the soccer mom crowd.

You made a mistake ... get over it.

Larry

This was your first problem.. you bought a car based suvee thing.. not a J**P...

Shouls have bought a TJ or even a Grand Cherokee

Of course not.. there based on a car.. not a real J**P

No the marketing ploy for real J**P's is that they can and do go almost anywhere, its just that you bought a Liberty.

I'll take it... and since you damaged it by off roading my highest price is around 5 grand.. oh and thats in Canadian $'s

Snow 93 XJ stock...

Man I smell another troll.......

hi mike, are you referencing 2 wheel drive sport quads?

Yeah, me too. I started to type a reply an thought, "What the heck, this is too easy!" No one would be that gullible and then post a story like that in the one place he should have checked before he shelled out all that money for a station wagon... ...trolls don't smell too good, neither!!! :wrinkles up nose: Jeeps are fine. Trolls suck.

Troll?

Nathan, I see where you're going with this... I think Mike is referencing inexperienced drivers more so than equipment. Having said that, there are a lot of places even a 'sport-ute' 4wd ATV with lockers can get stuck. The difference is you can usually get off and lift yourself over a big log or rock.

What do you think of the Yamaha Grizzly 660? I'm sceptical of the IRS but I like the power... I may settle for a Kodiak 450 if I buy anything at all.

-Brian

Nope, big 4x4 things 15-25 miles or more back in the bush on trails it took 2-4 hours to get there on.

We run on skinny twisty trails with lots of granite faces and big rocks in the way and tons of bog crossings and creeks. The Jeeps can handle some of those better than some ATV's because of the longer wheel base.

I could see serious damage happening to our Cherokee though if I didn't get the right line and my wife or I have to get out and spot now and then, but so far so good, we haven't managed to rip those damn running boards off yet....

My wife blew a week old tire off on a sand pit wall climb once though... I have had ATV's flip trying to follow me in my CJ7 up one pit wall, that was a sport bike of some type though.... Got photos....

Mike

Real Jeeps are built not bought.

These folks are all flavors, they just have never seen a Cherokee in that deep before, it is ATV's only in their minds that could make the road in.

Same for places we get the CJ7 into. I mean crap, they would have to scratch the pickup to get in there....

We ripped off the windshield molding and one rain gutter molding and got some nasty custom pinstripes on our last run early in the summer. It was either that or bottom on the rocks...

My summer project was a body job for the Cherokee and my wife isn't too worried about the scratches, it just got delayed.

Mike

certainly! that said, i own and enjoy both very much. i just cant imagine any place where a jeep can go that a 4x4 utility atv cant.

unlike jeeping, IRS on a utility quad is exactly what you want. atv's that dont have IRS use a swing arm that has ZERO articulation. based on this, the IRS is superior. the exception to this being the old arctic cat line (which is what i have, up through '02) uses an axle set up very similar to a tj (solid axle with 4 control arms and no swing arm). this worked very well but was dropped in favor of 4 wheel independent suspension because thats what the market demands.

to answer your question, the grizzly 660 is an AWESOME utility quad, i wouldnt hesitate to get one for a second. in fact, the yamaha rhino that im getting when theyre available in october

were they being idiots or something? ive taken my arctic cat 500 4x4 over each and every foot of trail at tellico, but i couldnt image even trying to do the same thing in my wifes xj (or my rubicon for that matter) and it doesnt have running boards.

show us the photos, show us the photos!!!

The Liberty was designed to "off-road" in shopping malls and soccer field parking lots. It's the nazi's way of getting even for losing WWI .... deceptive marketing with an inferior product.

I ask you this serious question: Have your EVER seen a German car NOT stuck when off road or in snow????? You NEVER will! On the east coast we use German cars (includes Liberty) as slalom gates when it snows.

Too bad you didnt join this group before you bought the POS Liberty. We could have warned you of its abomiable off-road performance.

Seems to me, you should started off with a little research! I find it hard to believe you accepted what the salesman was saying as the truth. One born every day as they say.

I can't keep the front end aligned on my 02 liberty just from daily street driving. I'll be damn if I'm taking it wheeling. I leave that for my CJ.

And BTW, I'm getting rid of my Libby soon also. 37k miles and it needs new tires along with another front end alignment.

Looks like another Ford Explorer for my wifes daily driver.

Ted

All that damage is not the Jeeps fault....come on now in less than one mile you tore up a new vehicle....thats YOUR FAULT. I bet all the other guys out there got a good laugh from ya! Stay on the golf course and limit your off road adventures to finding your lost balls in the rough.

Brian

And it's a shame...

Yeah... Never trust a salesman. Trust me... I used to be one... (sarcasm intended).

You should have researched elsewhere first. First of all, I, and others, really hate those dressed up Jeeps. You only need light bars if you plan to really light up the woods at night, and I don't think the lights on the Mopar light rack are even very strong lights. You might be better off with some nice quality bright lights on the bumper. Maybe two sets of them. Tubular side steps take clearance away and really aren't that much protection.

A little research would have told you how limited an IFS is off road. The wheel articulation is limited to the length of the A-arms movement, instead of the whole lenght of the axle on a rigid axle, and when the wheels come off the ground, they tilt inward at the bottom causing possible damage when the wheels touch down. Solid axles are far superior off-road, and I don't care if the Hummer has IFS. Hummers aren't any better off-road for most conditions than a stock Wrangler. Serious off road magazines have continually ridiculed the Liberty for how UNcapable it is off road.

Well, any damage from contact with rocks and stuff are the same as if you ran into a wall. It's collision damage. It's not their fault. Now, if you drove down a dirt road and something just broke on you, it is.

The only Jeeps that are truely for off-road are the Wranglers and Cherokees (XJ). The Liberty is a serious poser, intended to gain back marketshare for Jeep lost to families who use their SUV's as station wagons. The Grand Cherokee is actually decent off-road, from what I gather, but still nothing like the Wrangler.

WRONG! You just bought the wrong Jeep. Get a Wrangler Rubicon and try and convince yourself of that same statement. There isn't a factory made off road vehicle on earth as capable. Now, I agree with JP magazine that the low range might be too low for mud and sand, but with dual selectable lockers, small factory lift, 31" MTR mud tires, rocker protection, 4-wheel discs, and Dana 44's front and rear, you'd be hard pressed to find anything factory built that could do the things that Jeep can do.

Jeep can't help it you bought the hype and didn't know what you were doing! You simply didn't research your selection and bought a poser. That was _YOUR_ mistake and _YOUR_ problem. YOU bought the WRONG JEEP! My virtually stock '94 Wrangler will walk all over just about any 4wd vehicle you can buy new that isn't a Jeep! Bring on the Land Rovers, Hummers, or whatever you can throw at me...