Bull bars ban (UK)?

Thoughts? This reads as if it's no longer a proposal but actually will become law from next January. What does retroactive mean here? Does it only apply to new cars, or does it mean that cars already fitted with them can keep them? (I've never wanted bull bars, but if it will irritate Tony and his Euro colleagues I will make the effort.)

From The Times on May 27th:

QUOTE Bull-bar curb to cut road deaths By Rory Watson

A EUROPE-WIDE ban on rigid bull bars on new cars will come into force in January after MEPs adopted measures yesterday to improve road safety.

European, Japanese and Korean car manufacturers adopted a voluntary agreement three years ago not to install the equipment on their vehicles, but there is nothing to prevent drivers buying and installing it themselves.

The Transport Research Laboratory estimates that the legislation will prevent almost 140 deaths and more than 1,500 injuries among British pedestrians and cyclists every year. Under the measures, the frontal protection systems of vehicles of up to 3.5 tonnes will have to pass four tests to determine their impact when they hit children or adults. This will make rigid bull bars illegal, although the law will not be retroactive, but will allow the use of non-rigid equipment that manufacturers are developing to improve pedestrian safety. END QUOTE

Reply to
Richard Brookman
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Shame that parents don't teach their sprogs kerb drill anymore, or manners, or discipline, but then they never learn it themselves! Peter

Reply to
Peter

In the nanny state so beloved of this Government you're not allowed to take responsibility for any of your actions.

Reply to
Dougal

Time for a change then? Is there an English Liberation Army. If not why not? Peter

Reply to
Peter

I think with something like a series or a defender it is rather academic as to whether they are more dangeros to pedestrians with or without.

I don't approve of there use to dress up non utilitarian 4x4's though.

Reply to
Larry

just a thought, but why not spend the time and money educating children that the road is a dangerous place and teach them how to cross it accordingly?

richard ex tufty club member

Reply to
Richard Adcock

Cyclists especially, I remember the cycling proficiency scheme and I guess that gave me an erly grounding in roadcraft.

These days you practically need radar to see those cyclists one moment on the pavement the next on the road, and the idiots who nip up on the inside of you at traffic lights oblivios to any blind spots.

Reply to
Larry

This info may be out of date now, but when the law was proposed, it actually said that metal nudge bars could not be fitted to new vehicles. It did not say that they could not be fitted after-sale - a subtle difference in semantics that makes a hell of a lot of difference in reality. In other words, its just another of Smiling Tony's Non-Laws that keeps the reality-free quiche eaters in Hampsted & Finchley happy.

Richard

Reply to
beamendsltd

Not too sure about that. If you hit a pedestrian or cyclist with a Defender without bull bar the impacts is spread over a nice and flat surface, with a bar all the impact is on a much smaller surface area.

There was a case a couple of years back of a pedestrian being killed by a car with bull bar, and the coroner said the person would have survived without the bar.

But then I am not convinced the discussion is on a rational, fact based basis, it seems part of the general anti 4x4 bash. I read farmers might loose subsidies they receive when they allow 4x4 activities on their land, so they want us off greenlanes, and now they want to stop organised activities off green lanes.

I think it is more worthwhile trying to protest against these things than against bull bars stuff, where there are good arguments against us, and most of us don't need them, anyway. But then I have just moved from the UK to Portugal, no such issues here! Lots of people drive off-road and it is much more accepted, lots of TV coverage of trials etc.

Pieter

Reply to
Pieter Vroom

Interesting as we in Australia have a similar debate every so often fueled usually by the injury/death of a pedestrian in an urban area hit by a softroader fitted with some monstrocity stuck on the front.

Personally I'm not a great fan of bull bars unless you actually have a few bulls or roos or wombats to cause you some problems in your travels. Now when I was in the UK last year I tried to find roads swarming with bulls, roos and wombats - but to no avail. Plenty of dumb sheep that seem to have got the idea into their heads that Aussie tourists always carry a jar of mint sauce and a dutch oven to cook them in - so gave us a wide berth. We had to buy lamb much to our disgust and probably contributed to the UKs GNP by about 10%

Even bull bars dont do a great deal to protect you in the event of hitting a large enough animal, plus cleaning up the mess of body parts jammed into the bull bar is very puke making. They do protect the vehicle from low speed impacts though - which I'm sure is the main reason they are fitted by the parking challenged amongst us.

SIIA with Roobar and steel girder bumper SIII with Bullbar, rod holders, steel girder bumper Toyota Hilux with pedestrian killing bar Toyota Troop Carrier with a seriously nasty reinforced bullbar that helped push start a 10 tonne truck.

Geez I gotta get rid of those bullbars.

Reply to
Roger & Lorraine Martin

Sad to say, the lamb had probably travelled further than you had....

Reply to
Tim Hobbs

There's a few kids round here they can have for the tests..... TonyB

Reply to
TonyB

Yeah, when I was in Saudi it didn't matter if you had bars or not. In a saloon car hitting a camel meant the body would fall onto the roof and usually kill the driver.

TonyB

Reply to
TonyB

A trucks driver's worst fear in Australia is to hit a roo which has jumped up in the air and goes through the windscreen - usually not fatal to the roo

- usually fatal to the driver after the bloody roo starts kicking him out of the door.

The second worst fear is to be caught with a sheep in the cab!!

Reply to
Roger & Lorraine Martin

Or getting caught with a Kevin Bloody Wilson tape? TonyB

PS I've only just managed to find out who the bloody Leyland Brothers are!

Reply to
TonyB

loads round here too

Reply to
Angus McCoatup©

My 110 has a muckle great winch (required for it's role in motorsport), the bull bar actually presents a flatter frontal plane to spread the load over, rather than the winch simply smashing the legs!!

Still doesn't get away from the fact that the pedestrian shouldn't have been on the road in front of the vehicle in the first bloody place!

Yeah, and while we're at it, lets ban buses, lorries and coaches as well, they don't half make a mess of pedestrians and cyclists.

Now that's lucky! Badger.

Reply to
Badger

Hmmm.... Jobs for chavs?? LOL! Badger.

Reply to
Badger

That's got to be the obvious point. In fact lets ban everything and make everyone stay at home for their own safety!

Reply to
Moving Vision

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