Insurance Disc (UK)

Jan 28, 2004 38 Replies

On or around Wed, 28 Jan 2004 20:21:25 +0000 (UTC), "J A Kirby" enlightened us thusly:

a) not all the country has motorways but lorries go almost everywhere and

b) I've seen the effect of average about 2 per day artics on small roads round here - results in considerable damage.

lorry tyres are approx 11" wide, and thanks to large diameter have maybe twice the footprint-length of a car tyre. compare 'em with say a ford fiesta or something, you've got maybe 4x the footprint per tyre.

The 3x3 artic has 22 wheels (if they're all duals except the steer axle, and it's a 6x4 tractor) so it has 22x the area on the road. (assuming the 4 car tyres = 1 lorry tyre, footprint-wise).

However, the lorry weighs up to 44t, whereas the fiesta weighs about a tonne. so the load/area is about double for the lorry. And that was the best possible example: a trailer equipped with super-singles has 14" wide tyres, so the footprint is probably about 5x a car tyre footprint, but it only has 6 of 'em, not 12. Put it behind a 6x2 twin-steer, and the unit has lost 2 tyres as well compared with the 6x4. Now we have 6x5=30 car-tyres on the back, and 8x4=32 on the front for a total of 64 car-tyres, which is only

16x the car's footprint, and it can still be 44t, for 2.75x the load/area. Worse still, on narrow roads, with the super-singles nearly the load is concentrated at the edges of the road, where it's more likely to wear.

even at 38t gross, such an artic is still at 2.375 the specific load of the car. And you can run a 5-axle artic at 38T...

of course, there are heavier cars, but then they have bigger wheels - my

110, for example, is on 10" wide tyres, which are nearly as wide as truck tyres, so that's already got about double the area of the ford fiesta.

However, all is not lost - yer typical artic running 38t or 44t uses at least 3 times as much fuel as say a TDi disco, and probably at least 5x as much as the ford fiesta above, so it's already paying the extra duty, 'specially as it's about 3 grand for the VED as well.

On or around Wed, 28 Jan 2004 21:37:29 +0000, Tim Hobbs enlightened us thusly:

see my other posting about wheel loadings.

On or around Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:38:07 +0000, Mother enlightened us thusly:

and very funny it is too...

I can't work out if you're being serious here. IMO this is a fallacy, at least as far as running them is concerned. 4-stroke motorbike fuel efficiency is pretty poor, and 2-strokes have their own obvious problems.

Even the biggest bike can average well over 35mpg.I've got a 750 Ducati, and regularly get 50mpg.Mopeds are typically 80 - 100 mpg. And you need to take into account the amount of road space and parking space required for motorcycles.If everyone had a motorbike, there would be very few traffic jams, and an abundance of parking places, with no requirement to provide massive tarmac fields just for leaving a car while you go shopping. Alan.

On or around Thu, 29 Jan 2004 22:35:24 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@dev.nul (QrizB) enlightened us thusly:

The argument usually concludes that a car with 4 people in it is more ecologically sound than a bike, but that a car with 1 person isn't.

On or around Fri, 30 Jan 2004 07:40:17 +0000, "A.Lee" enlightened us thusly:

on the road, you rarely get more than 4 bikes in the space that 1 car occupies (in town sitautaions).

but a tad tricky to get the new microwave home on :-)

Richard

it would never be enforced, unless they can do it by camera!

Centralised data sharing and notification would cure this - whatever the systems used.

As would almost every traffik kop I've known...

All vehicles can be covered on a blanket policy but each individual vehicle must have a schedule under that policy. In other words, the policy covers the fleet, but the schedule details the level of cover, and any exclusions on a 'per vehicle' basis.

I once fell foul of this asswipe strategy (with a PC, not printer) as I'd been given a replacement PC under warranty. When that broke it apparently wasn't covered as the AN and Serial Number were not in their fecking database... I did get another replacement, but that's a slightly different story ;-)

Martyn

This is still the case at present though. When I (eventually) managed to tax Bungle recently the clerk at 'Sheffield DVLA' (tossers) simply cast an eye over the 'insurance' for a mere nanosecond...

Now there's an idea. I'm sure the Government would love to be able to shift the responsibility (and cost) of collecting road duty to the insurance companies!

Martyn

SG: Actually I did this just for the hell of it last night. Took about

90minutes to get to look authentic. Document and computer file have both been destroyed BTW :-)

I'm not suggesting that the insurance companies should collect road tax just issue a disc that shows the vehicle has insurance and when it expires. If holoigrams are supposed to make things less forgeable then it makes sense to use them for this too.

Regards Steve G

|| || I'm not suggesting that the insurance companies should collect road || tax just issue a disc that shows the vehicle has insurance and when || it expires. If holoigrams are supposed to make things less forgeable || then it makes sense to use them for this too. ||

One objection to this otherwise excellent plan that I heard on the radio today: many vehicles are used by more than one person. ATM, insurance is on the person not the vehicle. If the vehicle's owner (say) were to insure it insured-and-spouse-only and display the appropriate disc, how would we know that (say) his teenage son was insured for that car when he is stopped for running a red light? The actual schedule would need to be carried in the vehicle for the police to check, which rather negates the point of an easily-visible disc. How do we get round this? (I'm sure an ingenious solution will be along any minute.)

Get Tim to barcode everyone, say on the forehead, and have all the relevant barcodes printed on the insurance disc :-)

Simple, really.

|| || Get Tim to barcode everyone, say on the forehead, and have all the || relevant barcodes printed on the insurance disc :-) || || Simple, really. ||

LOL :-)

Oh bugger - he was joking wasn't he...

He may have been - but stranger things have become reality...

Don't you mean - CLOSET? ;-)

Martyn

Sorry, don't know the answer to that one ;-)

Regards Steve G

On or around Fri, 30 Jan 2004 21:47:00 -0000, "Richard Brookman" enlightened us thusly:

basic third-party cover for any driver on any taxed vehicle... but they'd use that as an excuse for upping the premiums, seeing as they'd not then be able to persecute anyone a) under 30, b) over 60, c) with any sort of record, d) who'd had a claim in the lats 5 years, etc etc.

Ideally, it needs a central system funded by the road fund licence to do this bit, and let the insurance market do the FT and comp style business.

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