Waterproofing a TD5

On or around Mon, 5 Apr 2004 15:54:14 +0100, "David French" enlightened us thusly:

thought it was inside... though of course that's no guarantee of it not getting wet :-)

one would hope that the connectors are waterproof. They'll obviously need checking that the various rubber plug covers etc. are sound.

It's in a plastic compartment just behind the battery, in the OSF side of the engine bay. If only it was inside, that would make life easier.

I'm wondering what else there is apart from the ECU. In terms of other gadgets and gizmos which would be averse to water. Also things like cabling connectors which might not be waterproof.

David

Based on some recent work I have been involved with, it would seem that the concept of an ECU is a little false. It would more correclty be the ECU's in the plural.

Most of them seem to have one for the engine management, one for the windows doors etc and possibly a third on some as well.

I am not sure if this is the case on the Disco, but considering the cost of replacement, it is worth making sure that you cover all of them assuming there is more than one.

I have heard that they reside under the drivers seat, but possibly this was in the 110 TD5. I was under the impression that most folk put them into a tupperware container and sealed with silicone around the plug entry points. You could also use a nice IP 67 ABB container from an electrical supplier with appropriate cable glands.

My best advise, as someone who has to fix my vehicle when it breaks is, avoid water if at all possible! You English seem to have a curious affinity for water and mud for some reason. I suppose that in South Africa we have a lot more scope to play while avoiding water. I will go through water if I have to, but then I know I should, Bleed the brakes, replace the diff oils, and gearbox oil. Regrease the UJ's etc etc.

Ideally you should extended the diff and gearbox breathers. Best to braze a connection to the air cleaner and then you diffs and Gbox will draw clean air from the snorkel. You also need to watch out for the viscous fan flinging water all over the show and I believe that on the TDi there was a wading plug that would fit somewhere on the cam cover. You should also let the engine cool right down before attepmting a deep crossing to prevent shock cooling the manifolds block etc.

All told I would say, keep the TD5 for moderate off roading and get a banged up series vehicle for the rough stuff.

Alternatively just make very sure that you have a good motorplan that covers all maintenance costs regardless of usage and get rid of the wagon before that expires.

Regards Stephen

It depends what you mean by ECU. If you take it to mean "Engine Control Unit", then there's one. If it's "Electronic Control Unit" there are lots.

I know there were 9 on the P38a. Haven't counted the Disco ones yet. But yes, avoiding expensive repairs would be nice.

The Disco Engine ECU is behind the battery. The rest seem to be scattered around, which makes the job harder.

But that's all the fun! If you have done the job well (like my old 200Tdi Disco) there's absolutely no need for major oil replacement.

Using the air cleaner is OK until you get pressure in the breather systems and you spray EP90 into the air cleaner. On my old Disco I teed them all into one tube (transparent so you could see if any oil was moving around) and ran them up to the top of the snorkel.

People are using TD5s more and more for serious expedition stuff. Vince Cobley, the Land Rover Owner International expedition guy, runs a 110 TD5 for all sorts of things including the Sahara. Not much water there admittedly, but a lot of other nasty things. I'm of the opinion that the Disco is designed as a hybrid off-road / on-road car so I don't want to waste it keeping to the motorways all the time. Yes, it's not as robust as a 200Tdi Defender, but it's pretty capable nonetheless.

I've not yet come across one that would cover a major engine rebuild if you hydrauliced it!

David

It was not quite fun, but we didn´t lost our humour through this, ah, happening. It was about five o´clock in the evening as we had to climb on the sidewall and as Brit-Fans we already were on a "mission" and so we had a virtual cup of tea, sitting on the sidewall, being stared on by the surrounding spectators ;-)

We will have to look for the condition of the engine and the electronics because it was lying for about 5 hours in the water. We will see what the insurance says.

It was my friends, from Germany (I am from Austria) my Land Rovers were waiting at home.

Raoul

At the time of driving in it was one and half meters deep :-]

We were idiots, it all came because on this day we came from the very south and already passed 20 or so Oueds and some 10 meters before the very Oued was one which was already deep but not so fast flowing. So we were to confident nodding to each other "where there is a Land Rover, there has to be a way".

Raoul

Now theres an irony if ever there was one, with the electronics all the wet weather advantage of a diesel is gone in one fell swoop.

I made the mistake of driving my grannie estate into water above the sill level, I was going up hill and there was a dip in the road that had been flooded by water running off the hillside with nowhere to go.

Anyway I did not get very far, my brother with superhuman strength actually managed to push it back out of the worst, but I had to find a friendly farmer with a diesel pick up to tow it the rest of the way out and then wait for everything to dry out before trying to start it again.

And now abou the solution .... Who has drawings of a waterproofing project? What to think about; repostioning the ecu, to where, how to make longer cables or where to buy etc Hope to get some answers from you all! Fred Defender 130 td5

"Larry" schreef in bericht news:c54c1v$2opvoe$ snipped-for-privacy@ID-129032.news.uni-berlin.de...

On or around Fri, 9 Apr 2004 09:12:50 +0200, "Fred Huge" enlightened us thusly:

well... There's no excuse for the actual ECU boxes not being waterproof, though I bet the sods ain't. Since for the most part they're sealed, I'd reckon the best answer would be to set the whole lot in resin. Sealed connectors are just a matter of spending enough. Alternatively, mount the ECUs in a proper sealed container and rewire to decently-waterproof plugs, with gold contacts to minimise corrosion problems, since nothing is ever truly waterproof. In fact, this is the typical problem with all automotive electrics - 12V stuff is not shorted out by water, but the water gets in the contacts and corrodes 'em. Same applies to motors etc., which can be more difficult to seal, at that. Alternators, too - most are air-cooled, and don't respond too well to being sealed.

The ECU itself in the Disco is sealed when supplied, but in my case the ECU's been replaced at some stage, which unwaterproofs the seal. But the connector doesn't look very waterproof to me, which defeats the point.

The plastic box the ECU lives in is not even masquerading as waterproof. There is a big hole in the bottom which is presumably there to let water out, but of course it very effectively lets water in as well - so the box acts neither as a sump (in the caving sense) nor as a bucket, either of which would at least be a start.

There has to be a great opportunity here for somebody to come up with a kit.

David

On or around Fri, 9 Apr 2004 19:29:57 +0100, "David French" enlightened us thusly:

one of the mags once did a bit about the military "deep wading" kit, but there's a lot more to it than a snorkel and a tall exhaust. ISTR it took about half an hour to fit bungs etc. all over the place.

mind, a decent waterproofing job wouldn't come cheap, I suspect - for a start, you'd probably have to rewire the connectors to the ECU and/or extend the wires to the inside of the cabin. Then there are a host of connectors all over the place, all of which are a) not waterproof and b) prone to corrode. Some of 'em would be difficult to replace, some would have to be modified to be waterproof - engine sensors etc. would have to stay as-is, and have waterproof plugs. There's more to it than meets the eye.

I'd like to start with the ECU and rewire the connectors to the ECU and/or extend the wires to the inside of the cabin. Is it possible to use a male or female connector combination for the ECU. In that case :

- I can use the original cables

- connect a extended cable with male/female connector, which I will pu in a sealed box

- remount the ECU in a higher place. Can this be done ?

regards Fred

"Austin Shackles" schreef in bericht news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com...

On or around Sat, 10 Apr 2004 17:10:27 +0200, "Fred Huge" enlightened us thusly:

If you can get the plugs, then extending the cables is just a matter of some suitable mutlicore cable, presumably screened would be best, with a plug one end and a socket the other. Depending on how robust the logic is, it may not actually need waterproof joints, other than to stop 'em corroding of course.