I think I may have found the ultimate cross country weapon

SEL was the top model.

Interior trim and fittings are so far ahead of the Octavia, it's laughable.

Cassette was standard on most cars of the era (remember, the B5 was launched in the mid 90s).

As for the rest of the spec. - what do you actually want?

You get full climate, a decent stereo (it may or may not come with a boot changer - if not, it's because a previous owner has ripped it out), electric windows all round, comfy seats, and bomb-proof build quality.

SEL was top spec. SE was, and still is, one above base.

Even at 180k miles, mine was still as fresh as a year old car inside. Not something I can say about higher mileage Octavias I've been in.

Great value cars, but you need a diesel.

Closer to 9 secs according to Parkers. (c:

Wisebuyers don't list an SEL for the 1997-2000 model.

Through the window a 2000 X Passat looks very similar.

Well, according to your raving about passats, a small fijian girl who pops out from under dash at moments of stress or when bored in traffic.

For single occupancy, is there really so much difference between aircon and climate? The Octavia and GT4 had aircon, the Celsior has multi-zone climate, all work properly, but apart from a little digital display that tells you the temp, I don't see what difference it makes.

Mine was at 130k when I sold it and looked mint.

I agree on the diesel, but unless I'm willing to travel 50mile plus just for a real pisstaker there doesn't seem to be much locally.

For a petrol turbo economy does't seem bad. Fuel Economy: Urban 25.4 Fuel Economy: Extra Urban 44.8 Fuel Economy: Combined 34.9 Emissions Data (co2 gm/km) 199

But not that much different to a late eighties Saab, but with a lot less power.

Here's an idea - try opening the door and looking / touching the inside. I an assure you that, although Skoda used similar designs, the materials and fit are significantly better.

They're about as reliable as Parkers, then - as they also say it has a 'Gamma Radio / Cassette' - which was the standard B5 SE unit.

I miss full climatronic, to be honest - I have semi-auto climatic now.

Climatronic is a very good system and well worth having.

But a lot less rust and other general mechanical issues.

Read maintenance to see how many problems Adrian has had with his late

B5s are utterly bomb-proof - in this respect they're much better than the B6 which replaced it.

Yet, other than routine items, and 1 missed recall (which I did even though there was no evidence I needed it just to be on the safe side), mine was bombproof except the usual weird front brake handbrake giving trouble,

It is still going strong too, with a years ticket on it, everything on it still working and going like stink. And it had made a round trip. Now at 170k miles with the original turbo, engine and box, I sold it to a guy in Durham, who sold it to a guy in Carlisle who stored it, then got it a ticket who then sold it the latest guy to own it, in Rochdale.

Far be it for me to be extolling the virtues of the Passat, but I have climbed through a few partly dismantled Octys and Passats in scrappys recently and there is quite a big difference in how the interiors of them are constructed. I'm not saying it makes as much difference as SteveH might have you believe, but the Passat is definately more expensively put together.

Heh, what do you mean? You don't even get buttons on the steering wheel in a Passat, let alone an "entertainment" system. (c:

Climate over A/C gives lower grade salespeople something to aspire to. Like adjustable cupholder covers and the little hooks to hang your jacket up in the back with.

Our Passat is at 130k. It's not mint but the interior has held up OK. It depends on what the car's been used for.

Then if you want choice, you have to travel. When I lived in Aberdeen, if one wanted a good car it quite normal to travel as far as about Newcastle or Manchester and back in a day. I bought 2 cars from near London when I lived there as local supply was limited.

Yes yes, but they're just figures. You're kidding yourself if you think a Speedy late 80s Saab is going to be comparable to a 1.8T Passat in real life. Not just in the fuel economy stakes.

On reflection, the Saab 3 door I had, while looking a little tatty on the inside was just about the second most sorted car I have had. The GT4 was the other but I spent a bundle on sorting the suspension and brakes on that. The Saab just got a set of cheap gaz shocks because the old ones were the original factory fitted 130k old Sachs. The springs were still good with no sag. Comfort was incredible and body roll was minimal for a design unchanged since the mid 70's. It felt old, but in a refined way, and felt really solid. Not necessarily soft touch and tactile, but the dash was padded, and the main contact points were leather. It was a car to be fondled and stroked, it was to be gripped and mauled.

Sounds like it was a good car to me. I was tempted to buy it off you when you sold it and I have been tempted to buy it since, when you've shown us it up for sale again.

I think it wouldn't be at all how you remember it if you were to buy it back, or buy another similar one though. (c:

I don't think you should worry too much about getting sick of whatever car you buy because you're going to get sick of it and want a different one anyway. Perhaps you should buy something like a Seat Marbella[1], get used to it, and then the car, *any* car you buy after that will seem really good.

The guy in Rochdale who bought it says it is a little rougher (the two owners in between both laid it up expecting to restore it but never did so MOT'd it and sold it on), but apparently it still goes like stink, and everything still works.

VAG also threw money at the mechanicals - having had the regular use of a Mk2 Focus TDCI on a contract I was working on last year, I can confirm that the PD Golfs I've owned / had the use of, were much more torquey.

Can't comment on the economy of the Focus, as it spent its life being ragged to death on short runs. ;-)

See... forget that I favour VWs and the like, but I've never really found myself driving along in a Mk4 Golf thinking, 'Oh dear, this drives like a sack of s*it'.

Nor can I say that I've ever got in a Focus and had 'the drive of my life' - yes, it's tighter chassis wise, but I'd suggest mechanically a PD Golf is streets ahead of the equivalent era Focus diesel in terms of power and where exactly it's delivered.

Again, this is your opinion.

As above, in my opinion the Mk2 Focus I used on a regular basis wasn't any great shakes versus the Mk4 Golfs I've had.

Both however were better than the Mk5 Astras I also regularly used to use. ;-)

-- JackH

Accompanied by the sound of a chisel on slate snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.co.uk, managed to produce the following words of wisdom

The TDi 140 Golf does go well, and I imagine the 170 GLF, but the Focus I've been driving lately seems more responsive. The Golf does go better at higher speed though.

I'm always disappointed by Mk4 Golfs. They should drive better than they do, they're ok at long motorway work but I always feel frustrated with them on A or B roads.

I'm always happy driving a Focus, whether it's in town, on the motorway or thrashing down a twisty little B road. They always deliver the goods, which is why I like them. All cars are compromises, but the Focus is a very good one. The Golf seems to err towards motorway cruising much more than anything else.

The only Astras that I don't mind driving are the Mk4? vans. They're quite good fun..

I hate to say this after I see less than 10-15 year old fords still showing the old rear light earth problems where they use the indicator as a brake light and vice versa, but a 2000 plate focus diesel looks to be something I might need to consider if a 9-3 diesel doesn't appear when I have some readies in my hand.

Nooooo!

That'll be the old TDDI engine, won't it?

Makes a VAG PD lump feel like a silky V12.....

I used to think that, but the Mondeo TDDi I was driving the other week wasn't that bad. I remember them being much worse than it was.

That's what mine has, sort of. I went the DTA route for simplicity and tuneability.

Dude it's a sad day when you're 'pedanted' by me on VAG matters hehe ;-)

Have I a hope in hell of getting a Focus TDCi Estate for under £3k?

Accompanied by the sound of a chisel on slate Doki, managed to produce the following words of wisdom

Yes. We paid £3500 for the above one, but only because it is low mileage and very nice spec, it'll retail out at around £4250 - no way the trade would pay more than £3700 for it.

There are normally quite a few in the autotrader for under £3k, ok they'll have done some mileage but should be fine.

Life is to short to drive Focus diesel estates.