40 mpg Prius vs 50 mpg European Diesel cars

Yes, the figures for the hybrid are US gallons. In the past year, my lowest mileage for a tank of gas has been 48 MPG; the highest has been

52 MPG. My highest ever was 53.4 MPG. And except for the first two tanks of gas, I have never had less than 46 MPG on a tank.

Keep in mind that two-cycle engines burn lubricating oil; that's what emits the smoke and odor.

BTW, when where you there? I was in Saigon from Sept to Nov 67, and in DaNang from Nov 67 to Aug 68.

A hybrid already has extra batteries so having the power to crank a diesel is not a problem. The hybrid controller would have to be programmed a little differently to allow for the additional power needed to crank a hybrid engine.

A diesel engine doesn't weigh THAT much more than a petrol engine. A diesel hybrid is technically feasible but it is not necessarily something that a consumer would pay 2 premiums for. There is a premium to build a diesel powerplant and there is a premium for a hybrid system, and it is unlikely that a consumer would pay over $5,000 more for a diesel hybrid.

As I mentioned before

There are a lot of totally ridiculous conspiracy theories floating around that the oil companies control the technology that goes into consumer vehicles. Since consumers buy a lot more cars than oil companies, the automakers have a lot more to gain by producing something consumers want than what oil companies want.

Again, the factors that make charging the batteries from household current are practical;

- the hybrid system has the capacity to charge the batteries as necessary so an additional power source is not needed with the current battery capacity.

- Adding additional battery capacity costs more money to build, adds weight to the vehicle, and reduces cargo and/or passenger space in the vehicle. Some enterprising do-it-yourselfers have fitted external chargers and additional battery packs at a cost roughly equal to the cost of the hybrid vehicle and they have had to use all of the cargo space in the car to do it.

A hybrid does get better fuel economy in city driving than at a steady cruise, however, it does get better highway fuel economy than a comparably sized petrol car and there are no losses in the generator and motor.

Rather than making uninformed guesses, you can read about Toyota and Honda's hybrid technology at their respective web sites.

I saw an article where a Westfield (or possibly a Caterham) that was unmodified except for special wheels / tyres, achived over 100mpg with a K series engine.

Not sure I'd want to drive it on the public roads with those tyres, in the photo they made 2CV wheels look low profile and sporty!

"Hybrid engine" is a misnomer. A vehicle with a hybrid propulsion system uses an internal combustion engine and a generator/starter and a special transmission that "mixes" the power from the IC and electric motors.

Toyota's hybrid system does start and shut off the IC engine as needed, it is not horrendous and most people are not aware that it has started or stopped.

Hmm, does it have a way of keeping the engine warm between stops and starts? I'd imagine that provided the oil and block were kept up to temperature, and you had an efficient way of storing energy to restart the engine it should not be too bad.

So it has valve lifters. Is the only reason this is not done on regular engines the extra complexity?

Spring 66 to 67. 22 TASS at Binh Thuy AB about 6 km from Can Tho in the delta. I was in Saigon only a few weeks in 66.

He's still referring to a hybrid. The IC engine would recharge the batteries. If I understand him correctly, he's thinking of a hybrid with a significantly bigger battery, that could simply go further without using the IC engine at all. If the car was used just for shorter commutes, the IC engine would never need to run. However, if the owner decided to take it out of town, he'd be spared the need to plug in every 30 or 40 miles (or less) by virtue of charging the battery from the IC engine.

An optional battery pack that lay flat on the trunk floor, perhaps, would extend the range of the vehicle in electric-only mode and would be an interesting option. An expensive option, no doubt.

If you were going on a long trip, it would probably be even more helpful to be able to remove the battery for the trip. That would increase the capacity of the car, probably improve its overall fuel economy and you'd not be likely to be plugging in much along the way.

And the car then becomes the ultimate flex-fuel vehicle. It's mostly fueled by whatever the power company finds to be cheapest at that particular time. Overnight, it's their base capacity, which is typically the cheapest electricity they can make. The nukes run all the time and probably make up the basest part of the base capacity in most places, so the car would be partially "nuclear-powered."

I could use a car like that. 90% of my daily drives are under 20 miles. If you could add enough optional battery to a Prius to give me 20-mile range (maybe 10), I'd drive it as an electric vehicle most of the time. The thing that keeps people from buying an Electric Vehicle is that while 90% of their trips are under 20 (or whatever) miles and, it's the other 10% that rule out the limited range of the EV. When they do go out of town, the maxium range of an EV becomes a real problem. Who wants to stop every 100 miles on a

1000 mile trip and wait 6 hours to recharge the car? A hybrid solves that problem, using gas to both get a 400+mile range and 5-minute "recharges." A hybrid with a bigger, removeable battery can act like an EV 90% of the time. As an EV, of course, it's carrying around a lot of unnecessary weight (up to 90 lbs of gasoline, the IC engine, etc) but there are tradeoffs for everything.

*** Posted via a free Usenet account from

***

So when I get 50 mpg, city and highway, in my Prius instead of "40 mpg", something is wrong?

Details:

Just curious, I keep having trouble getting below 50 mpg since I started driving by following the EPA City and Highway profiles. Could it be the warmer weather that seems to be more frequent now?

Bob Wilson

What is the physical size of the battery pack in the Toyota Pirus?

I do wish Toyota would change the name, I have a hell of a time with the spelling.

I've heard that it starts by use of the motor/generator, not a starter as in the normal sense, this makes the 'start' very smooth and quiet...

I thought that would make me nervous, but it doesn't. Instead it is rather nice to see that 0 and know you are not just wasting gas when stopped (unless you have some auxiliary item running).

Were your lowest MPGs during the winter? Mine were. Other than that I was always above 50, usually 52-ish. This year my mileage is even better.

Don't you love it? (Or not?) I love being shut down when stopped--and being able to not just waste braking energy.

Same engine as the new 407 Hdi coupe V6 twin tubo>

Yes the mechanical injector make clatter plus the mechanical injector pump as well. The common rail diesel are much quiter than mechanical injected diesel . A interesting point here is that indirect injected diesel (mech.) is quiter than a direct injected diesel (mech.).

Down under we are paying between $A 1.42 to $A 1.44 per litre for diesel.

Yandoit Australia

• * * + "A poor excuse is like an old bucket; doesn't matter what shape it's in, as long as it holds water" * PK Shaw

Even better is going down a mild grade at 70 mph with the ICE shut down.

Kari

Just got home. 146 miles mixed city/highway on my current tank. MPG (US) this tank 53.4.