OT: Tax

In Conor's world, that's not an issue.

The OAPs can sit on street corners with paper cups begging for handouts.

That'll be "a tabloid writer's" or "tabloid writers'", then.

HTH. :-)

Could you cite a reference for when that ever happened?

FFS.

It was just an example of how backward thinking Conor's view of taxation is.

I don't agree with many of the ways in which our money is spent, but it's better this way than having a true underclass of people whose only income is what they get from begging.

I think there may be an option between a) allowing lots of people to choose not to work, and paying for their upkeep and b) not providing benefits for anyone.

The problem is that all too often people bring up b) whenever the idea that some people may be able to work but don't, and should be compelled to do so. It's a bit like how until a couple of years ago any politictian discussing immigration was castigated as a racist. It adds absolutely nothing towards finding a solution to the problem, but simply keeps the argument going on in a circular fashion or silences the people whose ideas differ from those proposed by the media / govt.

Agreed, I'd like to see a middle ground.

I don't want to see a cut in taxation, but I do want to see people forced into working and more money being spent on healthcare and education.

The answer isn't, however, 'I'm alright, f*ck everyone else' as some people seem to suggest.

If you honestly believe that people don't think that way, you're living in a fantasy world.

Other societies manage to cater for their disabled without fleecing the living hell out of the rest of the population.

ROFLMAO. Have you ever been to countries like Italy, Spain or France?=20 They regard what we regard as acceptable fruit and veg as animal feed.=20 We get sent all their s**te.

Err....no.

Take a look at something like the Xbox 360 where you could buy it for=20 $299 USD, the equivalent to the USD price in Euros or =A3299.

You may want to start looking at some of the prices we pay.

--=20 Conor

I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't=20 looking good either. - Scott Adams

What OAP?=20

--=20 Conor

I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't=20 looking good either. - Scott Adams

Or do what previous generations did and have a pension.

--=20 Conor

I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't=20 looking good either. - Scott Adams

There has been evidence posted on here that it's not the common view.

Only you and Firth appear to subscribe to that view.

Some do, some don't.

If you look at the tables of taxation in developed nations, we're only around averagely taxed.

In the USA there are proper poor and / or disabled people who don't have any kind of welfare support - which I find totally unacceptable for a so-called 1st world country.

You rarely see proper beggars in this country, however, they were very much in evidence on my recent holiday in Portugal. Strangely, this appears to be getting worse as the country gains wealth.

If you'd prefer low taxation and having to privately pay for everything through insurance policies (and if you want to talk of rip-offs, insurance is the biggest rip-off ever) and pensions (another rip-off) then perhaps you should move to the USA.

Because having people admitting they'd rather be living on the dole than doing jobs which are available whilst the rest of us see our income taxes increase to pay for it is far more preferable isn't it?

Unemployment Benefit and Incapacity Benefit do more to keep people in poverty than to counter it.

Wrong.

They have stuff that looks iffy, but tastes fantastic.

We get stuff that looks perfect but tastes crap.

We're not comparing USD to Sterling - it's not a valid comparison anyway, as local state taxation rates apply to the US purchases.

I have, in fact I looked at digital cameras in Portugal a couple of weeks ago. They were no cheaper than in the UK.

ROFL.

Are you *really* as far out of touch with reality as you appear to be?

The state pension.

Try running quotes for the state pension through private pension calculators and find out how much it would cost.

By iffy, you mean its natural shape??

Which is kind of my point?

Actually, it's a valid comparison and forms part of the basis of "rip=20 off Britain". If we were to pay the same in monetary terms as the Yanks=20 for things, it should be (before taxes) half the figure of the USA, i.e=20 $200 in the US, =A3100 in the UK. But it isn't. There seems to be a $1=3D= =A31=20 currency conversion that goes on when selling things in the UK.

Now look at the same price from the US. Look at the prices for gas and=20 electricity. Or road fuel (not including govt taxation).

--=20 Conor

I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't=20 looking good either. - Scott Adams

Well, yes.

Perfectly formed, but s**te tasting veg. costs more to produce than 'naturally' shaped but good tasting veg, though.

And that's market forces, not 'rip off Britain'.

Market forces again.

Nothing to do with rip off Britain taxation.

Not rip off Britain, market forces.

However, road fuel is down to taxation, but that's the price you pay for having an NHS and welfare state.

Fuel is not longer significantly cheaper in Europe, either.

Just to add:

If you want to compare prices between the USA and the UK, then you need to do it as multiples of average hourly rates - which are significantly lower in the USA.

They also have less rights as workers than UK / EU workers and also don't have the same holiday entitlements etc.

I have...7.2% of income to meet the State Pension if my employer made=20 no contributions and I didn't increase payments in line with wage=20 increases. So I'm still quids in.

--=20 Conor

I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't=20 looking good either. - Scott Adams