Best no BS motor oil/filter comparison?

You are almost certainly referring to

Ed

I recall Consumer Reports did an oil study maybe 20 years ago. One of their better efforts at actually testing products instead of relying on self-selecting surveys and subjective opinions. They used the cars of a NYC taxi company and after substantial miles tore down and miked the engine internals. As I recall they found no significant differences between oils, and I think one was a synthetic. But I can't remember exactly. It was still a flawed test, since some of the limited number of taxis they used broke down and didn't finish the test, and they had no way to control drivers. Don't believe they even mentioned the latter fact. Wouldn't fit their "scientific" pretense. But at least they tried.

--Vic

React so? Hardly. Friendly? Certainly wasn't. Help? You were being an asshole about a typo. Usenet doesn't have an 'edit post' feature.

The test you are talking about was done in 1996. A copy of the article is available at

....

If that's what I think it is, it was a polyol ester base oil with pretty much the same additive package you'd find in any motor oil of that era.

I think pretty much all of the modern synthetics (that are really synthetic) use polyalphaolefin base oils but I may well be out of date here.

--scott

Thanks. Probably the best test I've seen. A real controlled lab test would be better, but cost an arm and a leg. I didn't notice any mention of filters in the article.

--Vic

Of course you get the same benefits with well-designed modern Group III base oils too....

Mark A wrote: se might laugh at.

which if I took the time to find out what brands and products they were while keeping up on any changes made and changed oil more frequently would save me what? 20 cents a quart? $5 a year? $10? What is supposedly (because I haven't bothered to look past the labels) the 'well designed modern' oil isn't cheap either. It's really not worth the time cost even if the modern dino does just as well in a janurary cold start.

Not pleased with the CR taxi test? I don't really care. I don't drive a Chevy Caprice or Ford Crown Vic, I drive a Camry. Besides, CR said that there was no significant difference in engine wear. They did not say there was no difference. Other tests conducted by BMW (and others) have claimed different results, which is probably why they specify synthetic as factory fill.

Since the auto industry is in deep trouble right now, I sincerely hope that people would keep using conventional oil (and switch from synthetic to conventional oil) and purchase new cars more often, so we can keep those people employed.

Any car can "go" 260K, 330K, or even 460K miles. Not many can go that long (or even 75K) and drive good as new without any repairs. I have to travel quite a bit, and I rent a lot of American made vehicles, so I have a pretty good idea what happens to them when they get over 30K miles on them.

Pick a name-brand (Castrol, Valvoline, Mobil, heck even Pennzoil is good these days) and their top-of-the-line non-synthetic. Job done. Basically just avoid buying the cheapest oil on the shelf, and you're in pretty good shape.

and changed oil more

More like $3-5 per quart these days! That's comparing something like Castrol GTX to Mobil 1 Extended Performance.

But like you, I do run synthetic. Rotella Synthetic in the cars with slider cams, Mobil-1 in the roller cam car. And for much the same reason- I don't want to do a research project every time I change oil. I do some googling around a couple of times per year to see if there are any big revelations, just to stay on the safe side.

But the bottom line really is that you almost can't screw up with oil these days unless you deliberately TRY to buy crap.

What are you calling 'repairs'? Some things people call 'repairs' are just simply replacing used up parts like dampers, clutches, and brake pads. I'll being doing some suspension work on my mustang in the spring to replace all the control arm bushings. After a 181K and 12 years they just don't work like new anymore. But that's what happens with bushings. I've been in and driven japanese cars with the same kind of milage and they don't feel like new either. Hell, they felt a lot worse than my mustang.

If you are refering to major engine repairs there are a lot of never opened engines out there. Especially domestic V8s. (and inline 6s when they still made them)

Mine did. And I just bought a used Jeep with 125k on the clock that drives just like new. I'll probably keep it at least 10 years and another couple of hundred K miles. Should be no problem for a 4.0 powered Jeep.

I have to travel

So I should judge Toyotas by the ones I get as rentals? If so, they're utter crap not fit to be on the road. And they smell bad, too.

Rentals are hardly a valid basis for judging a car on its merits. You're judging it on the abuses of the people who drove it like... well... a RENTAL car.

I meant net savings over time after changing oil more often with dino. I'm paying ~$4.5/qt for mobil 1(when I don't get it on sale) in the 5qt jug. I bought name brand dino for my '73 and it was ~$2.5/qt in a 5qt jug. I'm looking at ~$10-12 savings which would be erased since I'd have one extra oil change per year on dino.

That's true from a 'good enough' point of view.

Maintenance on my 1998 Camry V6 XLE has been regular oil/filter changes (all Mobil 1), radiator drain/refills, auto transmission drain/refills, air filter changes. I have also had to refill the windshield washer a few times, and quite a few tanks of gas.

Repairs would include new pads on front brakes, EGR valve, charcoal canister (replaced free just under the 8 year emissions warranty), replaced a couple of tail light bulbs and high rear brake light bulb, one new battery, and new tires.

I guess the EGR valve is the real "repair" that I paid for.

Maybe I should have qualified that. All the rentals have been Hertz or Avis (mostly Hertz). My company does not use rent-a-wreck. Some of the cars were brand new, almost all less than 3 years old.

That's roughly what the previous owner (a co-worker) of my '99 Jeep had done in 125,000 miles. He did have a front wheel bearing replaced, but never changed any fluids other than the oil (3000 mile intervals on cheap Pennzoil- which tells me that frequent oil changes render expensive oils fairly moot- although I use much better oil than that myself), nor did he ever have the brake pads replaced.

When I got it I changed all the fluids and the brake pads. It wasn't any worse for the neglect, really, and the brake pads even had a little life left. I popped the valve cover just to make sure it wasn't a sludge monster under there, and it was clean as a whistle. Even on the cheapest dino oil from Jiffy Screwb. I'll bet you anything that, barring a wreck, my Jeep is running many years after your current Camry and your next one are both in the junkyard.

So what?

Yeah, I'm Avis Preferred myself and that's all I ever use unless we need a truck, then its Hertz. So what?

Unless you're the first renter (which I have been a few times) then you have no idea what the previous renter did to it. I've had a few low-mileage rentals that I'm pretty sure got "Dukes of Hazzarded" a few times before I got them.

You seem to have this idea that Toyotas are in some way different. News flash... they're just CARS. All brands are pretty darn comparable these days, and have been since the early 90s. And Toyota has had some quality bombs lately that would make GM at its worst look OK .