SVT for 2005

snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com (Brent P) wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@comcast.com:

Right, but SVT isn't ever going to be a high volume deal anyway.

Even at 60 grand what are you going to buy from Porsche? Or even BMW? Then you take it to an SCCA event and get lapped by a version of the car your secretary is driving. The new 'stang is already off to a good start.

Not really. The Viper and Vette are special built platforms. The Mustang benefits from mass produced cheap components. I'm betting the new SVT will be in the ball park horse power wise but 20-30 grand less than a Viper or a C6 Vette. There is definitely a market for a car like that, especially with Shelby's name on it. Even if it does look like a secretary's 6 cylinder commuter car and doesn't handle as well.

Dan

"Michael Johnson, PE" wrote in news:H snipped-for-privacy@comcast.com:

I don't think the Mustang will be phased out anytime soon, as it's a decent money-maker for the beanies. However, I agree with everything else you guys have said.

The niche for a new Cobra is getting tight. Nobody's going to want to pay big bucks for the same platform that the V6 is riding on (even with mega-horsepower), as it's got its own limitations. If SVT's going to survive, it's got to come out with a new car that will make people drool over it, and they've got to make a profit doing it.

Joe Calypso Green '93 5.0 LX AOD hatch with a few goodies Black '03 Dakota 5.9 R/T CC

IMO, the DEW Cobra has to be about the same level of improvement as the DEW GT is over the SN95 GT for about the same price as the SN95 Cobra.

I dunno about the new stang, but SN95 was between a rock and hard place wrt to SCCA solo 2 when I went to the training course and autoX a few years back.

All I know is, the only other guy running a mustang besides me was giving his up for a porsche and he was already bending the rules with the mustang. Of course my experience is really very limited.

What's the benefit when ford is going to over charge, keep production down so dealers can gouge, and let the car's performance suffer because they won't put the money into it to make up for compromises done for the

If they keep the price under 40K and do it right yes. But here are the rumors that it's going to shatter 40K, and not have IRS. Sales droid at the stealership was telling me 55K and no IRS. I don't think a couple suspension mods and more powerful mod motor are worth a 25 grand premium. Of course, the sales droid could be wrong, and I assumed he was until reading the same sort of thing here.

"Michael Johnson, PE" wrote in news:BOmdne3RiIrzGK snipped-for-privacy@comcast.com:

Tough bill to fill. I hope they can do it.

Joe Calypso Green '93 5.0 LX AOD hatch with a few goodies Black '03 Dakota 5.9 R/T CC

I think they can. At least they are starting out with a good chassis. If they keep the '03-'04 Cobra brakes, improve the handling over the GT, use the T-56, use the blown 4V 4.6L motor tweaked to 450 hp and design a decent IRS then I think it will be there. They should be able to keep the price about the same too. IMO, the '03-'04 Cobra drive train was so good that they could use it virtually unchanged except for the IRS. This saves a ton of money on R&D.

On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 10:48:58 -0500, "Michael Johnson, PE" wrote something wonderfully witty:

Why not step up to the 5.4 and load that baby up with some more torque to further differentiate it from the GT? Yeah HP is great, but I've always loved low-end torque for a good launch. It was one of the things I simply loved about my Goat and its 455 HO SD. A decent launch would catapult me half way down the track. I would consistently post lower MPH trap times yet get great overall ET compared to the guys with the small blocks. Left a lot of guys scratching their heads as to why they lost against me when I never even broke 100 mph but had a trap time of ~ 12 seconds.

They already have the low end torque with the supercharged 4.6L engine. Also, the 5.4L is wide at the top of the engine which makes for a multitude of packaging problems and is why it is mostly installed into trucks and SUV's. Plus, Ford can make more than enough hp/torque with the 4.6L engine. With the hp raised to 450 I would expect it to have

I love low end torque too. Hence the reason I have a Kenne Bell blower on my '89 LX making 460 rwtq at 2,500 rpm. It makes for a fun ride.

We'll see at the NYIAS but as of December, according to my sources, the powerplant choice was the 5.4L, 3V, VVT with a Whipple (Lysholm) huffer. I'm not betting my last dollar, it's Ford after all, but I think the probability is reasonably high that my information isn't too far off ;).

Dan

snipped-for-privacy@nuail.com wrote in news:1110666566.070195.23970 @z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:

That's a killer setup. How about the rear? Still a live axle? And what about the tranny? And what'll it cost - around 45?

Joe Calypso Green '93 5.0 LX AOD hatch with a few goodies Black '03 Dakota 5.9 R/T CC

I hope you're right but I can't see Ford installing an engine in the Cobra that rivals the Ford GT's and undercut their future supercar lineup. I also think that engine would raise the cost of the Cobra to the mid to high $40k range. Too high IMO.

On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 01:09:19 GMT, Joe wrote something wonderfully witty:

I think they need to be real careful about the pricing. With a base Corvette starting at $43,710 I would think that is the magic number that they simply cannot surpass. After that number people will begin to think twice about which of the two vehicles to purchase. Yeah there will always be fools with more money then sense, and young kids, but there is a sensitive price point that has to be considered.

Even a base Corvette gives you the new LS2 6.0-liter small-block V8 that produces 400 horsepower and 400 lb-ft of torque which is the standard engine with either a 6-speed manual or a 5-speed automatic transmission. The prestige factor and other aspects of the car will make buy a Cobra, which is still just a Mustang after all, a very difficult decision if the price differential is not there to support the decision. I would say that if they bust the 40k barrier sales will not support production. Especially if it is just for 50 extra ponies which can be obtained from the Vette quite easily with a few aftermarket mods.

ZombyWoof wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

wrote

sources,

Indeed. This is what I was saying in another post. There's a small window for the Cobra to be successful. If it costs too much, people will buy cars like the Corvette for less money. If it's too low on performance, people will opt for a GT and maybe re-chip it.

Joe Calypso Green '93 5.0 LX AOD hatch with a few goodies Black '03 Dakota 5.9 R/T CC

On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 17:30:53 GMT, Joe wrote something wonderfully witty:

Perhaps these are the issues that the folks at SVT are trying to come to grips with? Given the prices of vehicles these days, 40k+ pickups and such, exactly how GM is able to pull of the base Vette, which is a pretty damn nice car for ~ $44k continues to amaze me. YEah you can load it up with a shitload of goodies and push it over 60k, but what you get with a base pretty much meets all my basic needs.

The new GT is cool, but why can't I choose to roll up my own windows or need 100+ combinations of my interior lights? If the really want to do something try and go the way the Z06 was originally supposed to be. Remember the concept of the Billy Bob Vette? All go and no show? How about a `Stang like that?

snipped-for-privacy@nuail.com wrote in news:1110666566.070195.23970 @z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:

That's what I'm thinking. Except the three valves. Why not four? They should be able to squeeze around 500 horse out of it.

Dan

ZombyWoof wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

wrote

number

automatic

support

pickups

IMO the market for cars like that is tiny, and the profit margin is even smaller if it exists at all. Sure, there are enthusiasts that would snap that kind of a car right up, but there's no way in hell Ford (or any other maker) would make a profit on it.

Joe Calypso Green '93 5.0 LX AOD hatch with a few goodies Black '03 Dakota 5.9 R/T CC

On Mon, 14 Mar 2005 11:35:25 GMT, Joe wrote something wonderfully witty:

You know what freaked the living hell out of Ford? The fact that people bought Explorers. That SOB is full of profit margin. One doesn't have to make a "huge" profit on every vehicle sold, one just needs to have a Marque that keeps all of it's customer base happy and provides them with all of the vehicles that they desire. This is what keeps them loyal and coming back over & over again.