Hot direct to the starter?

You can just splice into it and use a push-button.

Or, if you want to start a flame war, do this:

with a genuine Bosch relay...

Speedy Jim

..............Here's what I've done. I spent about seven or eight dollars for an indoor/outdoor 50 amp pushbutton switch at Autozone. Placed it on a some angle-stock aluminum riveted to the tunnel so that it can peek through that fiberboard kickpanel under the front of the the rear seat on the driver's side. Then I wired it to the positive post on the battery and to the spare electrical tab on the solenoid with some 12 gauge electrical wire. It was cheap and fast and will always work. At our age, push-starting can be a bitch!..............lol

I did the same thing this poster did and it worked great. Push botton behind the seat in the bottom of the back seat. Works all the time. I then put a relay in circuit with a fuse in so I could use the key switch like a human being. It never fails..........do it. Eric 62 Ghia 68 Bug both topless

Thanks Jim and Tim. Shall be done by tomorrow evening. I have the industrial button and 10ga wire.

Ok Jim I have to ask whats wrong with installing a VW recomended hard start relay? I have one in my 64 and have installed them in other air and water cooled vw and have never had problems with the cars starting after that.

yes I understand that a complete new wire harness would be idea but its hard to get some to spend $300 or more when they can spend $10 and get the same resalts.

Mario

Are we talking of those God-Forbidden hard start relays AGAIN!?!?!

1) you have a problem. 2) you choose to make your electrical system more complicated, and trouble-prone, by fitting a hard start relay in the car

And only because the "unreliable" original system failed after 30 to 40 years of service.

Think again. Keep it stock, and replace what is broken, instead of HIDING the problem. Really, it isn't going anywhere if you just keep adding junk in there. A hard start relay works, because it draws less amperage through the ALREADY faulty ignition switch.

What yuou are left with, is a more complicated starter wiring with corrosion prone wire connections, and STILL a faulty ignition switch, or simply corroded wire terminals at the starter.

In some cases, just pulling off the original wire connector from the starter, and putting it back on, would have fixed your problem. Why add junk in between?

Jan

Believe me it works great...........with a 30 Amp inline fuse...........Eric

The original starter circuit wasn't fused..

Sure it works, for a period of time.

But there's still something *simple* wrong with your car.

Ever cut your finger?

Did you put a band aid on your knee?

I'm sorry. This clearly is one of my pet peeves.

40 years of flawless operation. And you think you can improve it by adding cheap components on it, and making it more complicated. Oh well.

Jan

Mario, My middle name is "relay". I love 'em. But *some* people believe that if the VW engineers wanted relays in their cars they would have put them there.

There.....see how easy it is to start a flame war?

As a more direct answer to your question- the harness itself is rarely to blame. The most common problem is excessive voltage drop inside the Ignition switch. And replacing the switch may not cure it; most of the replacements are junk.

On '70 and earlier cars, the Headlight switch can be the problem. Yes! All power from the battery has to go thru this switch terminals to get up front.

Also possible is corroded crimped connectors at the harness ends, including the one at the starter solenoid.

So....choose your poison.

Speedy Jim

You sound like some kinda religious nutcase. What works better is a good thing. And it ain't complicated at all. Not writ in the ACVW bible is right.

Show me a ACVW that had 40 years of flawless operation.

I would recommend adding one of these high-quality switches to the ignition system as well tTo replace the ignition switch that's been working just fine:

your throttle cable breaks, don't replace it. Just use one ofthese: keep your carb clean, be sure to install one of these nifty plasticfuel filters in-between the fuel pump and the carb: install a couple of them in series. Speaking of the fuel pump,be sure you have plenty of pressure by replacing the stock one with anelectric one like this: last but not least pick up some of this stuff: do you need it, you ask? Why You Need DYNO-TAB®

1. Improved horsepower 2. Extended engine life 3. Reduced fuel consumption 4. Improved octane rating 5. Reduced carbon deposits 6. Extended plug life 7. Lowered emissions 8. Reduced maintenance/down time 9. Replaces lead protection

As always, I'm so very glad I could help! :-D

LOL

I can, and HAVE seen it work ok....

for who knows how long. (There's the gamble).

I just don't see any need for a a hard start relay, when everything is in good working order. Because there isn't any.

I just believe it is better to fix the root of the problem, than to rig up a workaround. Sure, it may not be a big deal if we are talking JUST about a starter relay.

But the very fundemantal way of thinking is what bugs me. if you fix a defective ignition with a relay, then the next thing you know, you'll be "fixin" a bunch of other problems with a band-aid solution as well. Sooner or later, your VW will be another example of "wiring nightmare", one most of us have seen more than enough examples of when buying used cars. (of any brand).

A band-aid fix on top of a band-aid fix.

It can lead to a total nightmare. And usually does, I am sad to say.

Seriously, new switches and new WIRES are readily available.

WHENEVER there is a possibility to fix the actual PROBLEM, it's better to do so than to HIDE it with workarounds. Doesn't matter if it's a car, a plane, or a refrigerator. I don't like the "easy" solutions, especially when people are suggested to take that route as the FIRST, and "best" course of action.

It's nit just a stupid starter circuit. It's the whole damn car. Don't be fooled by the easy route. It will stick. And eventually it will lead to a non-running car, an "unreliable" reputation, and abandoning the vehicle and hobby. Doesn't matter WHERE it starts from. Ignition, brakes, carb adjustment, ignition....

jan

There's one sitting on my yard right now, has been for 2 years. You are welcome to come take a closer look.

I'll even throw in a flawless, trouble free test drive. 6 Volts and all.

You pay your plane ticket. The rest is on me.

:)

Jan

..................heh heh........Those 'tabs' look a lot like suppositories. Maybe that's why you like them so much!

timmy

Nothing has ever failed? Bull. When something breaks because it's a lousy design, replacing it with the same lousy design is not a wise thing to do, nothing to brag about.

When the workaround is an improvement over the original system, it's call "innovation" and that's a Good Thang(tm).

Not going to use a relay. I'll use a brute dead-switch and #1 wire (cable).

............That's why I didn't put one in mine.

...............We're not talking about a relay 'bandaid' patched on to a worn out ignition switch here Jan. Stutzer and I have installed a brand new circuit directly from the battery to the solenoid through a brand new pushbutton switch that has enough amperage capacity to make it very unlikely that it will ever fail to energize the solenoid any time within our lifetimes and probably in the lifetimes of whoever inherits our cars after we're gone. Think of it as being like a coronary bypass. Your old coronaries got clogged up and diseased because you ate too many fried reindeer testicles and then guzzled down that dark rum to kill the awful taste of something that no decent American would ever let near their lips. Now, you have to have those clogged up coronaries bypassed with some brand new ones so that you can avoid that myocardial infarction that's waiting to strike you down when Kidd gets you in the sack within about an hour after your plane touches down in Florida.

timmy

hey Jan I have had mine in my 64 for awhile now and haven't had any problems yet.

Its kind of like converting from 6 volt to 12 and disc brakes, some times change is a good thing.

but I really go along with the idea of not hacking things together, next time I'll take Speedy Jims advice and look at the headlight switch. ( it makes sence now).